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6.5 creed run out

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/19/2017 at 11:45
supertool73 View Drop Down
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So I bought both Lee and Redding dies for my 6.5 creedmoor.  I have been resize and fire forming Lapua 22-250 brass in my Tikka 6.5 creedmoor.  After I fire formed them I full length resized them with the redding die and then ran them through the Lee collet die.  I then loaded them up 50 of them with 143 grain ELDX bullets.  I used the redding seating die.

I sampled 10 of them and put them in my Hornady Concentricity gauge and they were the straightest rounds I have even made.  Not even .001 of runout in any of them.  I would rotate the case and it would not even move the needle .001, it was crazy, it would barely move.   I was astounded.

I then proceeded to load 50 .308 rounds with new Starline brass.  I ran them through an RCBS full length die, and then through the Lee collet die.  I then used a RCBS competition seating die to seat 165 grain Hornady interlock spire point bullets.  I checked the run-out on them and they were in the .005 to .009 range.  I could not believe the difference. 

I am kind of baffled at what the difference is.  Is it that Redding dies are that much better?  Or is it the bullets?  Or both. 

Lapua brass probably had something to do with it as well.  But being they were stretched and formed to 6.5 brass from 22-250 I am surprised they were so straight. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/19/2017 at 19:38
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Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

So I bought both Lee and Redding dies for my 6.5 creedmoor.  I have been resize and fire forming Lapua 22-250 brass in my Tikka 6.5 creedmoor.  After I fire formed them I full length resized them with the redding die and then ran them through the Lee collet die.  I then loaded them up 50 of them with 143 grain ELDX bullets.  I used the redding seating die.



What kind of Redding form die?  i.e. full length with expander, bushing die with expander or bushing die without expander?

Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

I then proceeded to load 50 .308 rounds with new Starline brass.  I ran them through an RCBS full length die, and then through the Lee collet die.  I then used a RCBS competition seating die to seat 165 grain Hornady interlock spire point bullets.  I checked the run-out on them and they were in the .005 to .009 range.


I would guess that the RCBS die with the expander is creating the runout.  The Starline brass may be adding to the problem and so you are doubling up.  IOW if the Starline brass has varying neck thickness then runout will be created.  I use a lot of Lee Collet dies and RCBS Competition seaters and have never seen them to be a problem.  The Lee Collet will not create runout but it will also not correct runout.

What is the neck thickness on the Starline?  Does it have a thick side and a thin side?


Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/19/2017 at 22:30
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The redding is a full length with tapered expander. Not a bushing die. I will have to measure the starline
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/20/2017 at 05:55
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It's likely due to just what Bob said. If your brass has varying neck thickness, the case mouth is already non-concentric with the case body before you even start. FL resizing only makes the neck OD run true to the body, so if neck thickness varies around the circumference, your case mouth runs out with the body even if the body and neck OD runs perfectly true. The bullet locates in the neck ID. The expander button follows the neck ID, so if it was forced off center in the sizing stage by inconsistent neck thickness, the sizer button will follow and can only kick it off center even more.

The solution is to either use higher quality brass or neck turn just to the point you get full clean-up.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/20/2017 at 09:07
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Norma has 6.5 Creedmoor Match ammo and brass available now.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/20/2017 at 21:54
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You guys seem to be pretty opinionated on starline brass. Have you guys used it yet?

I opened another box of 50 starline. Sampled 10 of them. Neck thickness was actually quite good. .0155 to .014. I measured 10 of the lapua and they were .0125 to .0145. I have shot a lot of lapua in my .308 over the years and have neck turned a lot of them. Never thought they were that spectacular in that regard. That is why i was so suprised those round were so straight. I did nothing special to those brass for prep other than stretched them out from .22 caliber to .26 caliber. They are a little thinner now but hopefully will be okay.

I measured some new hornady 6.5 creed cases. .014 .0155. They were quite good too.

I turned 1000 federals and 500 lapuas once. Way to much work for my accuracy needs. Never again.

And yes i used a micrometer not a caliper. And they were all ran through a Lee collet sizer die.

I have a hornady full length bushing die. But it is set up for a different .308, i will have to try a few starline in it and see if it makes them any straighter.

Edited by supertool73 - July/20/2017 at 22:00
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/21/2017 at 05:23
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Actually, I have no opinion of Starline brass either way. I don't recall an instance where I've ever used it. Just saying that variable neck thickness is one of the main culprits of bullet to case runout.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/21/2017 at 08:33
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I don't either yet. I bought some shortly after it was available. Just starting to try it out now.
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