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Best options for magnification on PS90? |
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Ick
Optics Professional ICK, Ed's BOY Joined: October/08/2008 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 817 |
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Posted: January/26/2009 at 17:35 |
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Optics noob here.
I currently have a Leupold Mark 4 CQ/T on my M4:
The scope is great, but it is so darn heavy. I have owned it since March of 2003 and it works perfect for my M4..
In May of '07 I bought my PS90 and went SBR.
As you can see I put an Ultra-Dot Pan-V on it:
However I am finding that my eyes are REALLY awful. The PS90 is great with that sight at under 50 yards... but I find that over that range that dot is just too big and my eyes too bad to have any effectiveness. I absolutely LOVE this weapon for a wide-open field of view and quick target access. For that purpose the Ultra Dot Pan-V is great, but I find myself wanting magnification in my older age. So here is what I am looking for. I am looking for a light-weight solution to pickup some magnification like my Mark 4 CQ/T of approx 3x or so. Option 1 I have heard of guys getting those magnifiers that attach to rails with your existing red-dot or holographic. They flip back and forth so you can have it in place when you want it or flip it away when you don't want the magnification. Anyone have experience with those? What the heck are those things called? Option 2 If I do get one of those, I am not sure my Ultra-Dot Pan V is the red-dot to use with it. That Dot is ALREADY seems rather large and I can imaging having to look through this huge splotch when I use the magnifier, wouldn't that be true? What holographic or red-dot would work best? I would hate to have to get another holographic. Those huge boxy holographic systems I see on weapons might be a bit much for my taste. Option 3 A standard size ACOG would give me magnification and simplicity but I have two questions on those. 1. Can you rotate the magnification like I do on my Mark 4 CQ/T? 2. Wouldn't that size of a scope screw with my weight and balance of what is supposed to be a close quarters weapon? Aesthetically I am also concerned that a full size ACOG would look overbearing over such a small and light frame. Who wants a dumb looking weapon if that can be avoided? Option 4 I read somewhere&n |
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Ick, Ed's boy,www.ick.bz |
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supertool73
Optics God Superstool Joined: January/03/2008 Status: Offline Points: 11814 |
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ACOGs are fixed power. A compact ACOG in like 2 or 3x would be sweet for tha little gun http://www.swfa.com/c-226-trijicon-compact-acog-rifle-scopes.aspx
How about a 1-4x of some sort. There are a lot of brands of them that would do the trick in any price range. Trijicon, Leupold, IOR, Kahles, Swaro, Bushnell, Meotpa, etc etc. That would give you the best of both worlds. |
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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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While the PS 90 doesnt do much for me personally as it appears to be designed for a fire fight in a phone booth I would think that the correct red dot would be ideal on it. I really like the Aimpoint Comp M4. I also look at this gun and it just screams EOTech however the only ones of those that are magnified are the flip flop set up that I am not convinced is really the best of either world. I have a TA442 Trijicon that I really like the 1.5x however they make 2x and 3x models but note the eye relief and field of view when you compare them. I remember one guy posted a photo of one of these PS90 's which had the Trijicon Tripower 1x on it and aparently he was very happy with it. Cheaptrick bought one of these recently
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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Or you could point and shoot:
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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koshkin
MODERATOR Dark Lord of Optics Joined: June/15/2004 Location: United States Status: Online Points: 13182 |
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I think a Compact ACOG would fit this weapon perfectly. There 1.6x15, 2x20 and 3x24 version. I am playing with a 3x24 and it is a great little sight. I should have a review ready in a little bit (I'll have to sell it to fund other toys and that will hurt). Compact ACOGs come with two different mounts, one very high, for an AR, and another, fair bit lower for other guns. I am playing with the lower mounting type (called special ring base), which I think would work well on your PS90. It is not a variable magnification sight, but the magnification is still low enough to be very fast. THe best part is that the sight is incredibly compact with length of 4 - 5 inches and weight of 4 - 6 ounces, depending on the model.
ILya |
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Ick
Optics Professional ICK, Ed's BOY Joined: October/08/2008 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 817 |
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The problem I have noted with my EXISTING holographic is that when you look through a magnificaiton device the red dot is HUGE. Well, OK, perhaps not HUGE but it is rather large. How is the dot in that holosight? Is my current holographic too low-end? Would I find this to be ideal?
Here is another question about this system, how high above the rail system of the PS90 would the line of sight be? Is there any way to know that without getting my hands on the sysem and measuring it myself?
What is the overall length of that system? The info doesn't say.
Here again, my question is, with the thow lever mount, how high does the optic end up? I do have a Leupold Mark IV CQ/T that has 1 to 3x, and 1.5 times doesn't seem like much magnification. Edited by Ick - February/10/2009 at 09:46 |
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supertool73
Optics God Superstool Joined: January/03/2008 Status: Offline Points: 11814 |
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The dot is not any bigger in relationship to the target though ICK. The dot grew 3 times, but so did the target, so in reality nothing has changed. You should still be able to shoot the exact same.
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Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.
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Ick
Optics Professional ICK, Ed's BOY Joined: October/08/2008 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 817 |
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Do you guys sell those flip-magnifiation things sold separately?
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Ick, Ed's boy,www.ick.bz |
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Ick
Optics Professional ICK, Ed's BOY Joined: October/08/2008 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 817 |
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Supertool, wouldn't the dot on my sight be bigger? Here is my understanding of how my optic works, and how the flip-magnification works.
With my Leupold CQ/T the circle dot reticule I see is actually between the magnification area and my eye. With the flip-optic I am actually magnifying both the red-dot AND the distant target. Isn't the dot going to be bigger?
The dot on my red dot is irregular, sloppy and large now. Isn't it going to be even larger?
Perhaps it is time for me to get a quality holographic if I purchase the flip-up magnifyer.
Man, I am having a hard time describing this. I think I am up to edit #10 with this one post. Edited by Ick - February/11/2009 at 14:16 |
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Rancid Coolaid
MODERATOR Joined: January/19/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9318 |
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Don't get the magnifier. Let everyone fix the problems, then get later.
Or buy something else. Yours is not a long-range weapon, I'd advise 1X optic, both eyes open, fast on target, good enough for 100-yard shot if needed. |
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supertool73
Optics God Superstool Joined: January/03/2008 Status: Offline Points: 11814 |
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Your right Ick the dot will get 3 times bigger but so will the target
so the relationship stays the same. Putting magnification between you
and the dot is the same thing as a First Focal point scope. The
reticle or dot in this case grows at the exact same rate as the
target. So if your dot covers 3 moa at 100 yards at 1x and you put a
magnifier between your eye and the dot then then both the dot and the
taget both grow 3 times and it will still be cover 3 moa's on the
target. They are just both magnified 3 times so they are both
bigger.
If you were to put the magnifier behind the red dot between the dot and target then only the target would grow. Suddenly your dot would turn into a 1 moa dot becase the target is now closer but the dot stayed the same size. That is what an Second Focal plane scope does. It magnifies the target but the reticle never changes size. you have your diagram backwards for a second focal plane scope which your Leupold is the reticle actually sits between your eye and the magnification part of the scope. If you ever get a chance to look through an FFP scope while turning the power up and down you will see what I mean. And the highest mag, the reticle gets pretty big. At the lowest power you can hardly see it. But the size of the reticle always remains the same throughout the power range relative to the size of the taget. Hope that makes sense. Here is a good explanation of FFP vs SFP. http://www.premierreticles.com/PDF%20Files/First%20Focal%20Plane%20and%20Second%20Focal%20Plane%20Reticles.pdf |
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Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.
"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own." |
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Ick
Optics Professional ICK, Ed's BOY Joined: October/08/2008 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 817 |
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That is great, now I understand a little better. When I get home tonight I will look at my red-dot through my 3x scope and see what you mean.
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Ick, Ed's boy,www.ick.bz |
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Ick
Optics Professional ICK, Ed's BOY Joined: October/08/2008 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 817 |
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TAG to find this tomorrow. I never did get a better optic for this weapon.
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Ick, Ed's boy,www.ick.bz |
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Rancid Coolaid
MODERATOR Joined: January/19/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9318 |
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What is a reasonable max effective range of the PS30?
ACOG would work, as would several different versions of Aimpoint. Do you need to be able to hit something out to or past 100 yards with this? |
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Freedom is something you take.
Respect is something you earn. Equality is something you whine about not being given. |
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Urimaginaryfrnd
MODERATOR Resident Redneck Joined: June/20/2005 Location: Iowa Status: Offline Points: 14964 |
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I'm thinking you want something with magnification but something that lays low so how about some 30mm low rings and one of these:
Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - April/29/2009 at 20:48 |
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"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do". Bobby Paul Doherty Texas Ranger |
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Ick
Optics Professional ICK, Ed's BOY Joined: October/08/2008 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 817 |
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Is there some special order procedure or just do a cart and order like any schmo out there? Is there some kind of special discount that Ed give out freely?
Here is the ballistics chart on the PS90, does it answer your effective range question?....
The green and blue lines are the civillian ammo. Edited by Ick - April/30/2009 at 09:50 |
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Ick, Ed's boy,www.ick.bz |
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Rancid Coolaid
MODERATOR Joined: January/19/2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 9318 |
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Your corrected vision makes seeing a target at 50 yards tough?
If that is true, I'd get LOTS of field of view on any scope; the importance of FLAWLESS target identification cannot be overstated. |
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Freedom is something you take.
Respect is something you earn. Equality is something you whine about not being given. |
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