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Best varget loads for .308 Win.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/28/2009 at 17:26
sniper13 View Drop Down
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OK....This gives me a little to chew on, thanks
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/28/2009 at 17:37
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Well, Dale and Tool have made excellent points concerning the bigger rounds too and if your stick shoots them, rock on.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/28/2009 at 18:45
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yes its a completely stock 5r no break in , 5 shot group in the first batch of 100 rds. and yes it will do 1000 yds,

sniper-- you're getting the cart before the horse and haven't even got to the carrots yet. if terminal energy is not a consideration, the only thing that counts is BC, regardless of mass, (within a given group of comparison, obviously increased velocity will help). but BC helps in wind drift more so than gravity drop. The decreased drag of higher bc bullets cause less turning into the wind, which keeps the center of air pressure on the nose. This puts 6mm, 6.5 some 7 mm way out in front, of a lot of 308s. shooting at stuff at 1000+ yds is its own thing, but as McDonald said earlier -- all you need is a rifle with the tube screwed on straight.

Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/28/2009 at 20:40
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Nice group Dale, very nice.
 
factory remington barrels and 175's........seen enough of them over the last nine years to detect a pattern.  All of them that will shoot will shoot 168 Sierra's very well. Smallest group I've seen from a clean, new fctory tube was trhee shots into 0.093 inches from prone at 100 yards with factory ammunition.
If they won't shoot 175 Sierras, take a look at the crown.  Most I've seen would shoot 175's into 1 or 1.5 moa at 100 yards, but also do the same at 500 yards.  Touch up the crown and you may find new life in that factory tube.
 
Rating a rifle for dstance by bullet weight.
168 sierra are made for 300 meter competition, but we don't know any better so we push them further.  At about 850-950 in many factory barrels with factory ammo, the bullet is going sub-sonic and does not make the transistion very well.
However, drive that same bullet from factory 2575 or 2600 up to 2700 by reloading and you may find yourself doing well at 1000 yards, although the 168 doesn't cope with wind very well at that distance.
 
If your factory tube will handle 175's, drive them slow for short distances.  Seirras accuracy load drives that bullet 2485 fps. H4895 works very well for this and a below max load will push the bullet a consistant 2550fps with very low SD numbers.
Lower velocity will translate into less recoil, which means less distraction and less likely hood of being taken out of your NPA and trying to muscle your way back onto the target.
That low velocity load is also really consistant to 1000 yards with very controllable drift in the wind.
 
Should your rifle be able to handle the 190 Sierra, you are now into a completely different long range ballgame and the accuracy up close and at distance will amaze you.
Down side is recoil and the need to maintain your npa as that bullet will knock you about enough to move you out of position.
 
Just some things I've experienced.  Hope it helps.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/28/2009 at 22:48
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Mike ..I am not sure what you are saying about the168gr.being a 300y bullet. In the military I shot the m-24 .308 with a 24" barrel w/1:12 out to 1100yards and they issued 168 grainers. The distances that I shoot now are only 500-800y so would you say the 168ers wont be sufficiant, I dont understand?
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/29/2009 at 01:28
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Originally posted by sniper13 sniper13 wrote:

Thanks urimag....what do you think the optimal range of my set up would be??? 500-700y??? my optics are ss 10x42m. And do you think I should use 175's
 
Quite frankly I am begining to think it is pointless to use the 175 in a bolt gun if the 190 has the same velocity at the muzzle say 2600 fps.  However guns often like one weight bullet best.  Sometimes you use what you have though and I loaded a hundred 175 SMK  with 42.8 gr of 4064 tonight. It's getting tough to find powder and primers and brass so be flexable.     There really is no set distance, some of it will depend on how your range is set up and what distances you have access to.  Some guys that live in open country get to go out and put up a 4x8 sheet of plywood and shoot a mile but if you live in a big city you may have a tough time finding a hundred yard range. 


Edited by Urimaginaryfrnd - April/29/2009 at 01:48
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/29/2009 at 06:48
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So you were shooting M118LR?
 
Sierra made the 168 Mk for 300 meter ISU competition. 
It wasn't designed to go 301 meters, but does so quite well.  It's an easy 700-800 yard bullet but the wind drift is going to beat you.


Edited by Mike McDonald - April/29/2009 at 06:50
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/29/2009 at 09:14
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as mike suggest the bc difference between 168s and 175s below 2600 fps is almost .l or from .4 to .5.  this places the 168 in the same field as  69,thru 77 smk and with the higher velocities capable of the .224 these will "outshoot" the 168s.
a bigger problem here is consistency in reloading, to know when the rounds you are making are going through the reloading process so as to get get quality control. The shots and rds used in the 5r were loaded on a dillon, with a sloppy base plate, powder charges were thrown not weighted or metered, and dillons notoriously bad primer seater was used.The point being that there are many paths to a good ending as illustrated by the many different types of reloading routines, but in the end its all about the bullet. I get good 1200 yd performance with 168 with a 300 win mag, but the wind drift is 2x with any given velocity as a 210 berger. 168 hpbt are  used by alot of LE snipers for some reason I have (good reason) yet to hear.  
"some guys set up 4x8 sheet"  had to chuckle a bit-- trying to set a 4x8 sheet around here would get you ticket for paragliding without a permit.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/29/2009 at 14:40
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My Tikka Stainless lite likes 45.5g of Varget and 165g Sierra Gameking BTSP with a COL of 2.80
one ragged hole at 100 yards

same results in my bud's Tikka Varmint
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/30/2009 at 17:24
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Thanks Mike and Dale.....I think I will start with 43.5 gr. And I was told to watch group size at 300 and make my call, do you guys agree???? I can consistantly get 2" groups at 300y with fed. GMM.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/01/2009 at 07:54
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I have great success in a 5r barreo with 11.25" twist shooting 168 BT's with 44-45 gr of varget. Cci br2 primers & lapua brass @ 2.80.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2009 at 10:11
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What kind of velocities are you seeing??????
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2009 at 22:54
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How do you guys think a 150-155gr would work out to 500y witha 1:12????
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/05/2009 at 14:09
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Originally posted by Mike McDonald Mike McDonald wrote:

168 sierra are made for 300 meter competition, but we don't know any better so we push them further.  At about 850-950 in many factory barrels with factory ammo, the bullet is going sub-sonic and does not make the transition very well.


First let me say WOW what a wealth of information on this post!

Just an FYI. I have noticed this comment about the 168s not making the transition very well. And it was explained to me that it is due to the differences in the angle of the boat tail of these bullets and that is what is causing the problems. This came up when I was talking to an individual about which HSM ammo he would recommend that would work best in my Rem 700 SS 5R 308.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/05/2009 at 17:44
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Sparky,
The 168SMK is perfectly capable of making the 1K yard trip in handloaded ammunition with higher than factory velocities.  It's just such a poor performer at those distances I don't know why anyone would want to bother.  The angle you were referring to contributes to that.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/15/2009 at 20:58
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Originally posted by sniper13 sniper13 wrote:

How do you guys think a 150-155gr would work out to 500y witha 1:12????
 
If the heavier bullets get blown off course less why would you be after a lighter bullet. 
 I'd load some 175gr and 190 gr and see how they do. I saw some factory 180 gr Federal's that were about  $15 a box you might try some of those that would  be a good hunting load.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/20/2012 at 11:35
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I need load for savage10pc with a20in.1/10 twist barrel in 308 win. Deer size game out to 600 yards
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/25/2012 at 10:03
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I got the same rifle you described, sps tac 20 incher. Mine shoots allot of loads very well but seems to shine with hot loads. Mine likes 45.5 of varget with 168 amax, hornady match brass, and br2 primers @ 2.85 coal. One whole group all day 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/25/2012 at 10:19
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Originally posted by jselsor jselsor wrote:

I got the same rifle you described, sps tac 20 incher. Mine shoots allot of loads very well but seems to shine with hot loads. Mine likes 45.5 of varget with 168 amax, hornady match brass, and br2 primers @ 2.85 coal. One whole group all day 

Same here in my 20" Remington. I've found the BR-2 primers work a smidge better than others I've tried.  
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/25/2012 at 10:23
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Dont understand why everyone gravitates to seara match kings. Give the amax a try I have had mine out to over 700 yards with great accuracy! I have also weighed out boxes and found hornady to be much more consistent which I think is the real key here. I want to try a 155 load work up next. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: November/25/2012 at 10:43
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155gr. Lapua Scenars. MAGIC with "Vargay" in mine. 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2012 at 00:22
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Many years ago when the Hornady first made the 168 HpBt I started using them in the .308 Win. I have had great success with Varget powder and started using that in the .308 when it became available.
Now, except for one, my .308's are short and light (like fly weight) and used for hunting and I use 150 gr. bullets except for the bigger .308 where I use 175's.
 
I have shot many .308 rounds at 600 yds and more with the 168 Hornady with high scores and found it equal to the 168 Sierra MK.
 
Now I use mixed boxes of 168 Barnes tipped triple shock and 168 Hornady HP as they both shoot very well and at close impact points.  Hunt with the Barnes and practice and prelim sight in with the Hornady - this is with a .30-06 with H4350. The Hornady's are much cheaper than the Barnes.
 
My views are the 168 Hornady would be just fine but the 175's would probably be better at ranges beyond 600 (wind). All my rifles have a 1-10 twist but I had at one time a 1-12 and that shot 180's just fine but I would not want to try it with 190's and more. For my use I see no advantage in a slower twist than 1-10 in both .308 & 06.
 
The 168 Hornady is readily available and a good buy and a good load using Varget can be carefully but quicky (manuals) developed as this combo is popular.
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: December/05/2012 at 07:03
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Wow
This is an old thread!

My 20" LTR runs 44.2g of Varget with 175 SMKs and Nosler competition at 2575 FPS extremely well.
Much less wind drift at 500'than 165/8 and work well to 1k

I get about 12" group at 1k in a light wind and have busted clay pidgins.


Edited by ccoker - December/05/2012 at 07:40
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2013 at 16:30
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Okay, I know this is an old thread!  I was asked via PM to give a link to data I had talked about and told the person it would be a bit to collect it again. did not have the Handloader magazine (257) so it took some time to find where I stored the data.  I've gone through multiple computers since the first post.  Here goes.


 
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)     Back to Top Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/02/2013 at 17:02
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Great info thanks for posting!!!!
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