OpticsTalk by SWFA, Inc. Homepage SWFA     SampleList.com
Forum Home Forum Home > Scopes > Tactical Scopes
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Mil dot is metric no  Imperial units
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Visit the SWFA.com site to check out our current specials.

Mil dot is metric no Imperial units

 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
mannytx View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: May/16/2016
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 15
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mannytx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Mil dot is metric no Imperial units
    Posted: May/18/2016 at 08:08
Mil dot is metric no  Imperial units
Mil Dot is not in inches(no MOA), metric system is used throughout the world except the United States and England
First the metric system, as used in most military means ranges are in meters instead of yards. The Mil-dot reticles and metrics are more intuitive clicks this way: 1000 subtends 1 m in a range of 1000 meters. Therefore 1 / 10th of a Mil-Dot (one click on a metric turret) = 10 cm at 1000 meters and 1 cm in 100 meters very simple mathematics.
Mil turret, and a Mil-Dot reticle.(not mix MIL-Dot reticle with MOA turret)
Back to Top
supertool73 View Drop Down
Optics God
Optics God
Avatar
Superstool

Joined: January/03/2008
Status: Offline
Points: 11814
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/18/2016 at 09:46
Mil and MOA are both angular units of measurement, they have nothing to do with linear measurement.  The fact that mils happen to be work out with the metric system is just a bonus.  Once a person stops trying to make mils or moa coincide with linear measurement things get much easier. 
Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own."
Back to Top
Gerry Atric View Drop Down
Optics Journeyman
Optics Journeyman
Avatar

Joined: April/21/2011
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 340
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerry Atric Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/18/2016 at 10:42
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

Mil and MOA are both angular units of measurement, they have nothing to do with linear measurement.  The fact that mils happen to be work out with the metric system is just a bonus.  Once a person stops trying to make mils or moa coincide with linear measurement things get much easier. 

Amen to that, I do think that mils are easier to understand but it´s a discussion regarding two different angular units.

The old saying: "We are approaching the metric system inch by inch" is thus not applicable .......


Gerry Atric
Back to Top
mannytx View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: May/16/2016
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 15
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mannytx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/18/2016 at 11:28
the metric system is international, mils, centimeters, meters, kilometers
inches, MOA, yards, only  in the
United States


you need a computer to convert MIL and MOA, calculating distance or size of target
Soldiers
Back to Top
supertool73 View Drop Down
Optics God
Optics God
Avatar
Superstool

Joined: January/03/2008
Status: Offline
Points: 11814
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote supertool73 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/18/2016 at 12:24
Again, mils are not part of the metric system, trying to compare it to linear measurement just causes errors and difficulty.  In reality depending upon what country you are in, millradians are different as well.  So they will not be the exact same as linear metric system measurements. 

The only measuring stick you need in your reticle.  You can use that to make corrections or use it for holdover/offs for elevation or windage. Use a range finder to get accurate distances, as ranging with a reticle and doing it accurately is a highly difficult skill and is very easy to get errors.  It is just estimation, not a sure thing.  It is not likely you will know the exact size of your target, so a little error in your estimation and you miss.  A little error in your math and you miss.  It would be a neat skill to have, but unless a person is doing in daily it is just not going to stay with your.  With a range finder your chances for a hit go up dramatically.   

If you have an MOA reticle and MOA adjustments, MOA is just as easy as mils.  And 1/4 moa is a finer unit of measurement than 1/10 mil.  So if you are looking for more precision, 1/4 moa may be a better choice for a shooter. 
Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own."
Back to Top
mannytx View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: May/16/2016
Location: Texas
Status: Offline
Points: 15
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mannytx Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/18/2016 at 13:14
Here in Texas working with MOA and Leupold, only grandparentsSpeedy
Back to Top
Urimaginaryfrnd View Drop Down
MODERATOR
MODERATOR
Avatar
Resident Redneck

Joined: June/20/2005
Location: Iowa
Status: Offline
Points: 14964
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/22/2016 at 16:23

"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do".
Bobby Paul Doherty
Texas Ranger
Back to Top
MikieG View Drop Down
Optics Apprentice
Optics Apprentice


Joined: December/10/2014
Location: Oklahoma
Status: Offline
Points: 187
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MikieG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/22/2016 at 22:51
I have always used MOA. I can see inches pretty well in the scope. So MOA adjustment calls are reasonably accurate for me. But i see the beauty in matching reticle/turrets. So i have replaced all my optics and got into mil/mil. Wish i would have done so sooner!
Mil,MOA, either can be used with awesome effect. Matters not which one you choose, concept and execution are exactly the same. Ita the turret/retical match that is the key here.
Back to Top
Urimaginaryfrnd View Drop Down
MODERATOR
MODERATOR
Avatar
Resident Redneck

Joined: June/20/2005
Location: Iowa
Status: Offline
Points: 14964
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Urimaginaryfrnd Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/23/2016 at 15:20
There are a few scopes that are MOA Reticle with MOA turrets.
http://nightforceoptics.com/reticles

"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do".
Bobby Paul Doherty
Texas Ranger
Back to Top
Cold Trigger Finger View Drop Down
Optics Apprentice
Optics Apprentice


Joined: December/20/2013
Location: Int.Alaska
Status: Offline
Points: 209
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cold Trigger Finger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/18/2016 at 17:00
I made a mistake when I got my first 10x42 . Mil Dot reticle moa turrets. The 1~4 Classic is much easier to use due to being mil/mil.
The problem causing linear measurement happens to me when estimating the height or width of the target. Then it bleeds over into drop and drift.
You are being watched.
If it can't be grown, It's gotta be mined
Back to Top
doublechaz View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper


Joined: March/02/2010
Location: AZ
Status: Offline
Points: 19
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote doublechaz Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/23/2016 at 19:54
Mils being an angle measure works in American units as well.  1000 yards away a 1 yard target will be 1 mil.  Just check your mildot master...  1000 feet away a 1 foot target will be 1 mil.  1000 inches away a 1 inch target will be 1 mil.  I use it this way very frequently when shooting at tiny targets with a .22 such that all shots must be doped to score a hit.

But, yes, matching reticle and turrets is the only way to go.
Back to Top
Cold Trigger Finger View Drop Down
Optics Apprentice
Optics Apprentice


Joined: December/20/2013
Location: Int.Alaska
Status: Offline
Points: 209
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Cold Trigger Finger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/23/2016 at 21:40
I guess I never fully thot about the 1=1,000 in any unit other than yards or meters. But, that makes perfect sense.
I guess because I started out with a mil dot master. A tool that I really like. In fact, I need to make it a point to add the cost of a MDM into the price of every future scope I buy. Didn't get one when I bought my 1~4x24 and regret it. Those they are a great and tough tool. They are kinda fragile inside cold weather. If kept in a couple layers from my outer parka, they are fine.
You are being watched.
If it can't be grown, It's gotta be mined
Back to Top
Rancid Coolaid View Drop Down
MODERATOR
MODERATOR
Avatar

Joined: January/19/2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 9318
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rancid Coolaid Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/24/2016 at 09:31
i too have a mil dot master, but with s smartphone, now use apps that do way more.

If you'd stop thinking in inches, adjusting fire gets much, much easier!
Freedom is something you take.
Respect is something you earn.
Equality is something you whine about not being given.
Back to Top
dsr View Drop Down
Optics Apprentice
Optics Apprentice
Avatar

Joined: May/31/2007
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 244
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dsr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/24/2016 at 12:08
Well here is something to think about. Radians are a angular unit of measure where one radian is just the radius of the circle wrapped around the circumference of the circle. So there are 2 Pi radians to 360 degrees. Now here is where it gets interesting - the Sin function from trig is defined as the ratio y/r where y is the height of the triangle and r is the radius if the circle. For "small angles" the Sin of the angle is approximately equal to angle -ie- the height of the triangle is equal to angle.

One problem of 'mils' is there are some definitions where 2Pi doesn't equal 360 degrees.
Back to Top
Mike McDonald View Drop Down
Optics Journeyman
Optics Journeyman


Joined: September/01/2004
Status: Offline
Points: 739
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mike McDonald Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/24/2016 at 13:40
Mil measurement is transgender.  It can use either bathroom equally well. Cool
Back to Top
beetroot View Drop Down
Optics GrassHopper
Optics GrassHopper
Avatar

Joined: August/06/2015
Location: New Zealand
Status: Offline
Points: 8
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote beetroot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/01/2016 at 04:38
What you can do if you have a SFP MOA scope but a mildot reticle is put your own magnification marks that basically turn the Mil reticle to a MOA reticle. 4 MOA is very close to 1 Mil.

Design and print a target with markings at 4moa @100yd/ 4inches (4.19 to be exact) and set this up at 100 yards exactly. With your scope adjust the magnification ring until the mildots line up with the 4moa marks and mark where on your scope this point is. 

I have done this on my Nikon Monarch, the Mildots were accurate at 12x but they become 4moa dots at 10.8x, which funnily enough lines up perfectly with the 1 on the 10x magnification mark.
Back to Top
Gerry Atric View Drop Down
Optics Journeyman
Optics Journeyman
Avatar

Joined: April/21/2011
Location: Sweden
Status: Offline
Points: 340
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerry Atric Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/01/2016 at 06:56
I thought this was pretty good:

http://precisionrifleblog.com/2013/07/20/mil-vs-moa-an-objective-comparison/

(The 50 comments below the article is worth a reading)


Gerry Atric


Edited by Gerry Atric - August/01/2016 at 07:11
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.01
Copyright ©2001-2018 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.184 seconds.