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Working on a load for 300H&H |
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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Posted: June/11/2007 at 16:46 |
I have a 300H&H with a 26 inch barrel. Started on a new load for 200gr Nosler Partition. Some interesting stuff. The difference a correct load could make blew my mind. Unfortunately we do not have your powders but Somchem products. The powder I used was Somchem S365. It seems close to your (American) powders Imr4350, H205, Hercules Rel19 or RWS R904, if this makes sense. Anyway, started at their mid range of 57 gr, which went all over the target. Gradually worked my way down to 51,5 gr and got a reasonable grouping. I only measured the velocity of this "accurate" load at 2450ft per sec. Very disappointing. It has been suggsted that I go to a slower burning powder, the Somchen S385. Below are the targets for each reduced load.
57g S365
55 gr S365
53 gr S365
51,5gr S365 Edited by 8shots |
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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Further to the above load development I also swithched to a 165gr Spartan bullet. This is a monolithic bullet in the BarnesX class. I got this bullet to settle down at 56g S365. Velocity measured at 2846 ft per second. Also disappointing for a magnum. Again need to check out a slower burning powder. |
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pyro6999
Optics Retard OT TITAN Joined: December/22/2006 Location: North Dakota Status: Offline Points: 22034 |
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how did the r-19 do?? i would maybe try r-22 although that last target looks pretty good for a big gun like that what is that like 5 shots under a 50 cent piece??
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They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead" 343 we will never forget God Bless Chris Ledoux "good ride cowboy" |
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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Pyro, maybe my posting is not all that clear. I only used S365 powder. We do not have access to your powders. On the web I found a table that compares our powders to yours, and the powders I listed was the comparitive American(?) powders. I enclosed thge list so that hopefully it would make sense to other readers on the forum. Yes, I am quite satisfied as a hunting rifle to go with the last target. However for a 300H&H I should be seeing speeds in excess of 2950 ft per second on those bullets. Hence wanting to try slower burning powders.
Can anyone give me the trajectories for the two load/ bullet combo? Out to 200 and 300m. 165g Spartan (BarnesX) at 2850 ft per second zeroed 2 inches high at 100m and 200g Nosler partition at 2450 ft per second and zeroed at 100m??
It will be much appreciated!!!! |
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Dale Clifford
Optics Jedi Knight Joined: July/04/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5087 |
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it is likely that your powders are made by norma which would make them indentical to the R alliant series
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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Dale, Thanks for your help on this one! I am going on my first hunting trip for the 2007 season. We are going for kudu in the Eastern Cape. We leave on Thursday for a two day hunt. So hopefully I will have a few pictures to share! Our Somchem powders are in fact made in South Africa by the Somchem company. They are a division of the Denel Group which made our arms and ammuntion for the "White Apartheid Regime" during the embargo years when the world turned their backs on us. They did then and still now have State protection as an essential service, hence only their powders are freely available and used by all South Africans. They do make a good range and a good quality product. |
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Dale Clifford
Optics Jedi Knight Joined: July/04/2004 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 5087 |
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superiority of one powder over another is highly overrated-- as long as they go boom (smelling good counts) as long as you have a relative burn index you should be able to "hone" in on the good zone. Good luck on your hunt!!!!
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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Thanks Dale. My friend and I have been invited on a "corporate" hunt. Someone we do business with is taking a couple of guys on a business trip. Not all of them are hunters, but they will go along for the beer and the venison. We have been invited along on an all expenses paid providing we do the shooting for these none hunters. We said we needed some time to think about this..... about a split second!! So we have an open cheque book to shoot a good couple of kudu. Hence the frantic load development and getting my new rifle up and running. |
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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I have returned from the hunt and accounted for 4 kudus and 4 springbuck! I used the Spartan monolithic bullets and on the accuracy level did very well. I opened my account by taking a kudu cow at 250m with a headshot. The springbuck also fell to head and neck shots. But the knockdown effect of these "light" bullets suck and I will not use them on kudu again. I did not shoot anything outstanding, so no pictures to drool over. We went for venison animals. I had to let a very good bull go as he was just to clever for me. He kept his vitals obscured by branches and bush and finally evaded me. So I am back at the range with a slower powder Somchem S385. As you can see from the target the rifle just does not like the hot loads. Damm The 67 gr should give about 2800ft per second. I tried 67, 66 and 65. I will try 64 and 63 next.The 63 should still give speeds in excess of 2600 ft per second. The shots we take are long excess of 250m going to 350. 1 and 1 = 65g 2 and 2 =66gr 3 and 3 =67gr
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pyro6999
Optics Retard OT TITAN Joined: December/22/2006 Location: North Dakota Status: Offline Points: 22034 |
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i dont know take this for whatever you want but i havent had any success with anything over .308 cal buy trying to load it hot, usually i gotta keep stuff under 3000fps to make it shoot worth a damn, 30-06 300 winm 300wsm anyways.
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They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead" 343 we will never forget God Bless Chris Ledoux "good ride cowboy" |
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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Thanks Pyro6999 for your input. The projected speed on the "hot load" I was hoping for is 2800ft per second. The loads I am going to try later today should be around 2600 to 2700 fps. So the speeds are actually not that hot, hence my dissapointment.
Edited by 8shots |
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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Basics, basics, basics. I must stick to basics! I went back to the range today and tried 62 gr, 63gr and 64 gr. And then something told me to try a different seating depth (maybe a page out of the Reloading for Dummies book). I used 66gr and seated the bullet 2mm deeper then the day before. I have been using 91mm which placed the rounds a mm of the landing. So I seated the 66gr at 89mmOAL. And then things started to come together! The shots marked 4 and 4 was 66gr behind a 200gr Nosler Part. This should give me a decent speed of 2700fps+. So with a bit of fine tuning I think I have a good load for Mr Kudu Bull.
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pyro6999
Optics Retard OT TITAN Joined: December/22/2006 Location: North Dakota Status: Offline Points: 22034 |
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that looks pretty good.
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They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead" 343 we will never forget God Bless Chris Ledoux "good ride cowboy" |
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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Ok to finish the development thread from my side, I tried to get to a load that will get me out there as in 300yds+. So I pushed the envelope a bit to see what a faster speed would do at the correct seating depth. I went one gr over the recommended 67grS85. The 67 should give 2750fps. So at 68 I am hoping to be over 2800fps. Will chronograph later. At 68gr I got a very good indication grouping at under 1/2inch. The idea was to test if a sweet spot excisted at higher speeds. I will be hunting with this load of 68gr behind a 200gr Nosler Part. |
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8shots
Optics Jedi Knight Lord Of The Flies Joined: March/14/2007 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 6253 |
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I went hunting on 6 Jul 07 with the load of 68gr S365 behind a 200gr Nosler Partition. Before the hunt I put the bullet over a chrony and got 2850fps. I also shot at 200m to check bullet drop. I was 1.75 inches high at 100m and zeroed at 200m. I shot this Kudu at a distance of about 300m+ (unfortunately left my rangefinder behind). The shot was a frontal shot and I missed the chest. The bullet took the left front shoulder high up and completely shattered the bone, anchoring it for a kill. So the load and bullet performed very well. |
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303Guy
Optics Apprentice Joined: September/02/2007 Location: New Zealand Status: Offline Points: 55 |
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Nice one 8shots!
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Regards
303Guy |
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303Guy
Optics Apprentice Joined: September/02/2007 Location: New Zealand Status: Offline Points: 55 |
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Dale, all South African powders are made by Somchem of S.A. Some of their powders are pretty good! I was getting a velocity spread of 2 m/sec (6 fps) in my 303 using MR200.
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Regards
303Guy |
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303Guy
Optics Apprentice Joined: September/02/2007 Location: New Zealand Status: Offline Points: 55 |
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8shots, have you checked for run-out? Just a thought, but if seating depth has that profound an influence, it could be that your cases are getting distorted when seating too deep.
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Regards
303Guy |
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louissr
Optics GrassHopper Joined: April/15/2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 18 |
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As a long time lover of H&Hs, I have found, contrary to any loading book, that RL-25 works very well in long bbled 300 H&Hs (26"). I'm using 78 gr with the 168 TSX and it chronys at 3090 and will keep 5 in less than 1". It also shoots MOA or less to 300. This is in a 1951 or 2 Remington 721 AC with a TIGHT chamber (no other fired case from my other 4 300 H&Hs will fit in it) with a BalVar 5 in Leupold Adjusto Mounts.(A 1950-60s hot outfit!). All I ever used for decades was 4831 but RL 25 gets the same fps with no pressure signs so I'm converted. (I have also tried H1000, WMR, H870 and 4350 in the past)
With the TSX's shape, and a factory leade, the normal max 300 H&H OAL gives you the setback you must have off the lands to get Barnes to really shoot. I just bought a box of the new 180 MRXs (ouch $) and am anxious to try them. A little trick that I have used with 300 H&Hs to test loads that always seems to work, is to load 5 with the same load with Hornady A Maxs of the close/same weight as the desired Barnes hunting bullet. Strange but true, if the A Maxs shoot so will the hunting bullet. It also worked in my new 260 DMPS LR with the A Maxs (140s) making 1 hole and the 130 TSXs doing 3/4". I have not tried it with other brand hunting bullets so I cannot speak to it being generally true. |
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pyro6999
Optics Retard OT TITAN Joined: December/22/2006 Location: North Dakota Status: Offline Points: 22034 |
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so how is that .240h&h treating you? |
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They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead" 343 we will never forget God Bless Chris Ledoux "good ride cowboy" |
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