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Installing a picatinny rail

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Trickster View Drop Down
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    Posted: July/15/2012 at 15:11
Hi

My new scope should be arriving shortly, and with it I should also get a new set of rings and a picatinny rail.

Here's the deal - I've mounted scopes before, but never a rail. How is this done? I've done some searching and found a couple of tutorials on how to do it, and one thing caught my eye - bedding using epoxy resin and/or gluing the base to the rifle. 

What's your opinion on this? How important is it, to have a proper bedding? What's the tolerance (if the rail fits 100% then you don't need a bedding, if it's only a 99% fit you need it)?

I've been getting a lot of different opinions on this, so I thought to ask here.

Thanks for the intel.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jonoMT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/15/2012 at 17:36
In some cases the top of the action may not be entirely uniform and could bend the rail slightly. I've never seen this with any I've mounted. I do think it's good though to use blue loctite to slightly bed the rail and it helps keep moisture/corrosion out of there. The main thing is to follow the manufacturer's torque specs. A good quality rail is going to help.
Reaction time is a factor...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trickster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2012 at 00:22
A good rail I have (ordered).

I'm a bit concerned about my rifle's system - it's a X-Bolt rifle and has 4 screws as opposed to 2 like most rifles have - this might make it more tricky to install.

My pops has some epoxy which he says is also good for metal. I'm a bit hesitant though, as it's not labelled. I tried applying it to a wrecked riflescope that I own, and I'll see, how it holds.

Otherwise I was looking at JB Wled or Loctite 3450 as a good bedding compound. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitterroot Bulls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2012 at 08:27
We have discussed this in a few different threads.  I didn't know they were making rails for the x-bolts.  Which one did you go with?
 
I am firmly in the bedding a rail camp, mostly to eliminate ring alignment problems.
 
Here is a video I made on what I do:
 
-Matt
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trickster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2012 at 12:22
Thanks for the info Matt. Great video by the way.

I'm gonna give it a shot, however I first need to find some epoxy. I got a sort of crack filling adhesive today, but so far it's not really good, it doesn't stick properly and it also crumbles. (just now I noticed that it's water based Big Smile)

The rail I got is a standard 0 MOA Picatinny rail form ERA-TAC (http://era-tac.de/)

EGW also makes a rail for the X-Bolt.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SVT_Tactical Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2012 at 12:27
JB weld is cheap and readily availible, Ive use it for years on small stuff.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitterroot Bulls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2012 at 12:33
JB Weld, Devcon 10110, or Marine Tex are all great steel reinforced epoxies that will do a great job.  I like the consistency of the 10110 putty the best.
-Matt
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jonoMT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2012 at 13:29
I suppose there's no real harm in it. Heck, I'm firmly in the integrated rail camp (Surgeon) anyway.
Reaction time is a factor...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stickbow46 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2012 at 22:25
+2 on the jb.I like using Marine tex as a gripping agent.Works very well on my 5R.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trickster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/16/2012 at 23:21
I just tried using my dad's epoxy (the unlabelled one Big Smile) again (the first time I didn't mix it well enough) to bed a set of rings to a wrecked riflescope. I left it to dry and this morning it hardened really well. I used Kiwi shoe polish as a release agent and the mount came off the riflescope with ease, leaving a solid layer on the inside of the rings.

I think I'll give it a shot. I'm meeting a friend today who has some said he has some epoxy, I'll ask his more about it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trickster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/17/2012 at 15:33
I ordered some JB Weld today (good a nice opportunity), however, I read something somewhat alarming- supposedly this doesn't hold in cold. Can anyone comment?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trickster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/17/2012 at 15:37
got a nice opportunity*
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitterroot Bulls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/17/2012 at 17:04
JB Weld is a brand that markets a few different epoxies. The JB Weld you want is the two part steel reinforced epoxy. Is that what you ordered?
-Matt
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trickster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/17/2012 at 17:17
Frankly, I don't know. 

Under product name it says JB Weld JB Autoweld one of the world's strongest glues COLD WELDING.

Here's a picture of the product:


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trickster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/17/2012 at 17:29
I also managed to find a description form the same site (I didn't scroll down enough earlier Big Smile)

BTW sorry for the poor translation, it's form Google Translate, since I really didn't feel like translating this manually form German Smile

JB Weld Adhesive 2-component binder
Probably the strongest glue in the world

JB Weld is considered the strongest glue in the world! He was 30 years ago, develops in the United States and is found there, sold millions of copies, in almost every household.

The 2-component epoxy resin adhesive is used universally, and really creates lasting connections. Whether metal (like eg iron, steel, aluminum, brass, bronze, copper, tin, etc..), Wood, glass, ceramic or plastic - JB Weld glue everything - super durable and resistant (an adhesive surface of only 1 x 1 cm holds a load of 278.4 kg was)!

After mixing the 2 components can JB Weld be processed for 25 minutes. After 4-6 hours the best adhesive result is achieved after 8-15 hours, the adhesive is fully cured. Now he can - as if it were made ​​of metal - painted, painted, sawed, dowelled, ground or sanded.

JB Weld is shrinking and not crack during the curing process. A clean glue line remains clean (as in soldering or welding), a smooth surface remains smooth. This is JB Weld are the ideal solution where high-precision work is required.

The cured adhesive is water resistant, withstands temperatures to 315 ° C, oils, acids and chemicals (even battery acid). Can the hands during processing easily be washed off with soap and water. Does not smell, because without solvent.

Open another 25 years (!) Stock!

- Packaging: in polybag, 17 x 7.5 x 2 cm, 75 g

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitterroot Bulls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: July/17/2012 at 17:53
The picture is of the correct product. It holds up in the cold just fine, and according to the manufacturer "resists extreme temperature fluctuations." Haven't heard of cold problems with it, but I have heard of it with quick-set epoxies like JB Kwik.
-Matt
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trickster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2012 at 05:30
Ok, so I (finally) got my mounts today. 

I tried installing the rail and checked for fit - I tightened the front screws and tried to slip a strip of normal copy paper under the back of the rail and the other way around. The only place, where I managed to slip in the strip was the front left corner of the rail (from the perspective on the picture). Should I still bed it?

Another thing I'm not sure about is the release agent. If you put it into the screw holes, doesn't it act like a lubricant? I have standard Kiwi shoe polish. I'm generally not a big fan of gluing screws, I stripped the screw heads on the bases I had before the rail and I didn't use any thread locker or tighten the screws down too much (Shocked).

Thanks for the info. Here's a pic by the way (still waiting for the scope):


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trickster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2012 at 05:53
Quote  The only place, where I managed to slip in the strip was the front left corner of the rail (from the perspective on the picture).

Disregard this, I just noticed that all of the screws are not the same and after putting the right screws in the right places I can't fit the paper strip anywhere, nor can I spot any movement if I apply pressure. 

I don't think it's necessary to bed. What do you think?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitterroot Bulls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2012 at 08:45
It is my understanding that the 4 bolt system on the x-bolt is supposed to minimize mount issues. If you mount, tighten, and torque the rail on properly, find a machinist's level and check the rail for level. If it is all square, i would say you are GTG.

Nice looking rifle.
-Matt
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Trickster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: September/05/2012 at 09:29
Thanks again for your tips and compliments Matt.

Earlier, when I was checking for fit, I was messing around with a bubble level. It seemed pretty level to me, but I will do some more "measurements", before I torque anything down. I have to wait for my scope to arrive anyway.

I'll post some more pictures when I get everything in place. 


Edited by Trickster - September/05/2012 at 09:51
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TheSwede Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: March/24/2015 at 17:54
I wonder if there is a way to elevate a rail with bedding? I have a expensive rail but want a 20 moa elevation, shouldnt it be possible with bedding somehow?
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