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Leupold Mark 5HD 3.6-18x44

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koshkin View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Leupold Mark 5HD 3.6-18x44
    Posted: August/11/2018 at 23:59
Here are to reviews of this scope, one by Bill Meyers and another mine.  We were not comparing notes and working on these independently, so it is pretty neat to see two independent assessment go live at about the same time:



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SageRatSafaris Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/12/2018 at 22:14
Great reviews. When you said you were going to complain about the reticle, I assumed it was TMR or CCH or Tremor3. I was surprised you didn't like the H59 - seems like the best of the MRAD tree reticles Leupold offers. I'm contemplating purchasing a Mark5HD H59, but before I do, I'd like to hear more about why you don't like H59, and what features you look for in a tree reticle.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/19/2018 at 13:36
Originally posted by SageRatSafaris SageRatSafaris wrote:

Great reviews. When you said you were going to complain about the reticle, I assumed it was TMR or CCH or Tremor3. I was surprised you didn't like the H59 - seems like the best of the MRAD tree reticles Leupold offers. I'm contemplating purchasing a Mark5HD H59, but before I do, I'd like to hear more about why you don't like H59, and what features you look for in a tree reticle.

I have not seen any Horus reticles that I liked.  H59 is not the worst of them though.  I dislike Tremor reticles even more.

Leupold's CCH is a little better, but not by much.  

I think all of these are unnecessarily busy with the grid blocking too much of the FOV.
Primary aiming point is not sufficiently well defined.
The grid going so far down at low magnification is just stupid, IMO.

Let's take H59.  Under what circumstances do you need 38mrad of the vertical span of the grid on 4x? 

On lower magnification, it looks like a very fine mosquito net that is not visible enough to make a decent aiimng point, but is visible enough to make it hard to see.  It is kinda like the worst of both worlds.

If they took the top 12 mrad or so of the reticle, added a few thick bars for low light visibility on low power and got rid ov ereverything else, I would like it a lot more.

Practical considerations aside, Horus has some of the most dishonest marketing in the gun and optics world and that is a very difficult bar to clear, since marketing departments of all the major scope companies seem to be filled with semi-literate snake oil salesmen.

The guy who originated Horus brand was just a lying sack of manure best I can tell, although now that Nightforce owns them, perhaps they will go about things differently.

ILya
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kickboxer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: August/19/2018 at 16:30
I've tried, very hard, to like the Horus reticles, not much success.  However, the H59 is a favorite of that type.  I'm still trying to find a way to like the Tremor.  It is not a favorite, though I TRIED to "make it so..."
Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CrazyEddie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/15/2019 at 08:50
Thank you for the review - and the other reviews linked therein.  What rings are you using on the Toric in that review?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/15/2019 at 10:28
Bll Meyer reviewed the Toric, not me.  He is using M10 rings from American Rifle company.

I have very little personal experience with these rings, but people like them.

ILya
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JGRaider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2019 at 07:10
Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:

 

The guy who originated Horus brand was just a lying sack of manure best I can tell, although now that Nightforce owns them, perhaps they will go about things differently.

ILya


Google Todd Hodnett, the guy who invented the Horus reticle.   I know the guy, and he is not a "lying sack of manure" as you say.  He's a great guy.  In fact, he is the premier long range sniper trainer on the planet, and has likely forgotten more than you, me,  or anyone else on this board will ever know about ballistics, shooting, etc.  You may want to rethink that quote.   
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2019 at 09:55
If you listen to Todd, you can definitely walk away thinking that he is the premier sniper trainer on the planet and that he also invented reticles, shooting, the internet, the abacus, etc. He is umdoubtedly a good shot and all, but the whole snake oil salesman bit leaves people a but polarized. Go talk to Frank Galli about Todd. He has more history there than I do.

That having been said, the guy I was referring to is not Todd Hodnett. The name was Dennis something. He was the litigious founder of Horus. Todd did not invent a Horus style reticle and if he claims to have done so... Well, you get my drift.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JGRaider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/21/2019 at 11:17
Don't know Dennis  whoever, but Hodnett has no peer, regardless of what you think.   There's a reason he trains snipers from all over the world, literally.   Proof's in the walk, not the talk.   

I could be mistaken about Hodnett developing the Horus.  If so, I misspoke and apologize, but there's not mistaking TH"s abilities.    To say otherwise is pure ignorance.  

Curious, how many times have you visited with him, or been to his shooting facilities first hand, in person?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/22/2019 at 03:13
We certainly disagree on the "Hodnett has no peer" bit.  He is probably one of the world's best snake oil salesmen, although I do not think that is what you meant.

I've met Todd, but I have never been to his shooting facilities.  As I said, I suspect he is a very good shot and probably a perfectly good instructor.  I do not think I said anything negative about his abilities as a shooter at any point.  As I understand the history of it, Todd had a habit of picking people's brain and learning a thing or too from other instructors, and then proceeded to pass that off as his own original invention.  I think he took a class or two at Rifles Only when he was phasing out of cowboy shooting into precision.

I am not going to make any claims on who has no peer and all that since using your logic I would have to personally visit every shooting school in the world to figure that out.

If I ever make it out to go shooting in that part of the country, I am much more likely to go spend some time with David Tubb rather than Todd Hodnett.

On Todd developing Horus reticles: I think he had a hand in Tremor reticles, but original Horus designs were definitely out before he got involved.  If memory serves me right, Horus recruited him to sell their reticle to the government about a decade after Horus started out, but I could be off by a year or two.

Either way, as I said, if you are interested in Todd's history in the shooting world and why so many people dislike him, check with Frank Galli.  He and a few others know a lot more detail on that than I do.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JGRaider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/22/2019 at 08:14
Thanks Koshkin.  I'm really not interested  in what other  people think, as I've met  the guy and  been there numerous times.  I wouldn't expect everybody to like TH anyway, as there's lots of jealousy and egos being deflated with TH's success.   Nobody likes the perpetual winner (NE Patriots???) Since  I've been hunting up there for 20 years, I  know and trust lots of people who know him, and they do not share this Galli guy's opinion of TH.   I also know the landowner where TH instructs, and he won't let just anybody on his property.   

I've also had the good fortune to visit with Tubb several times.   If you can get past a slight bit of ego, his knowledge is overwhelming.   Since he's the most accomplished LR shooter ever, he's earned the right to be proud of himself I think.   He is helpful though.  

Yes, I do believe personal experience trumps other's opinions every time. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote koshkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January/23/2019 at 01:16
If you are not interested in what other people think, why are you arguing with me about it?  I am very comfortable with agreeing to disagree on this one.

As far as personal experience bit goes, while it is a perfectly viable opinion, it is antithetical to the entirety of human civilization since it is based to a significant degree on learning from the aggregated experience of others.

With all that, I am at SHOT and there is all sorts of interesting stuff here.  I'll meet with David Tubb tomorrow.

ILya
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