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barrel twist rate, ar15 ?

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Topic: barrel twist rate, ar15 ?
Posted By: michiganman
Subject: barrel twist rate, ar15 ?
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 11:05

can anyone help me out with barrel twist rate. I always had a hardtime under standing this area.I'm setting up my rock river lar-15 (223) for target/varmit matches ,so im getting ready to buy a new barrel. the one i have my eye on is a rock rivers varmit (bull barrel ,stainless) in ether 20 or 24"

the varmit matches shoot up to 300y and now my ? what are these twist rate's  good for and what grain bullet is best for what rate
1:8
1:9-
1:12-
 
thanks for the help



Replies:
Posted By: supertool73
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 11:07
1-8 80-55ish
1-9 69-50ish
1-12 55-40ish


-------------
Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

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Posted By: Midwest_Hunter
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 11:15
A basic explanation of barrel twist rates is, the heavier the projectile, the faster the twist you need.


Posted By: pyro6999
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 12:57
i was told once that you can never over spin a bullet.

-------------
They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead"

343 we will never forget

God Bless Chris Ledoux
"good ride cowboy"


Posted By: Bigdaddy0381
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 13:01
Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

i was told once that you can never over spin a bullet.
 
Thats B.S. 
a 30somthing gr var grenade will not shoot out of a 1-7 twist 22-250. they hit like buckshot even at 20 yards.
 
 
 


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Ecclesiastes 10:2


Posted By: Bigdaddy0381
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 13:01
I think urimafrnd posted a chart awahile back. would be a good sticky. if someone finds it.


-------------
P&Z Firearms , Pro gun cleanings and gun repair and wood refinishing.

Ecclesiastes 10:2


Posted By: Sparky
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 13:03
I have a Rock River Varmint in both 16 and 24 inch barrels with a 1:8 twist. Mine seem to like the 69gn SMKs best. I had asked Rock River what weight worked best in the 1:8 and their reply was 68 to 72gn.


Posted By: pyro6999
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 13:05
Originally posted by Bigdaddy0381 Bigdaddy0381 wrote:

Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

i was told once that you can never over spin a bullet.
 
Thats B.S. 
a 30somthing gr var grenade will not shoot out of a 1-7 twist 22-250. they hit like buckshot even at 20 yards.
 
 
 

at what speed?


-------------
They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead"

343 we will never forget

God Bless Chris Ledoux
"good ride cowboy"


Posted By: Bigdaddy0381
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 13:09
Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

Originally posted by Bigdaddy0381 Bigdaddy0381 wrote:

Originally posted by pyro6999 pyro6999 wrote:

i was told once that you can never over spin a bullet.
 
Thats B.S. 
a 30somthing gr var grenade will not shoot out of a 1-7 twist 22-250. they hit like buckshot even at 20 yards.
 
 
 

at what speed?
 
all speeds, from the test and things I have done with them. Its the heat that makes them come apart something about the inside melting. I went 4 gr below min and it still did it. went 3 gr about and it still splated them.


-------------
P&Z Firearms , Pro gun cleanings and gun repair and wood refinishing.

Ecclesiastes 10:2


Posted By: pyro6999
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 13:13
 a 30-something grain bullet in a 22-250 is just asking for trouble.thats like shooting a 90gr bullet out of a .300mag


-------------
They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead"

343 we will never forget

God Bless Chris Ledoux
"good ride cowboy"


Posted By: Bigdaddy0381
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 13:19
I agree but you can over spen them just like you can under spin one. Like my 243 with the 105gr berger. they hit side ways.


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P&Z Firearms , Pro gun cleanings and gun repair and wood refinishing.

Ecclesiastes 10:2


Posted By: pyro6999
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 13:23
ok im on board with you, im just saying i heard somebody say it. i didnt necessarily agree, i was just on a sight reading a little, and they said that in general the slowest twist you can use is the best (for accuracy) at least in the competition world. i usually try to match bullet weights in my guns by using the heaviest bullet with the most accuracy. in .224 45-55gr bullets have been very reliable for me.

-------------
They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead"

343 we will never forget

God Bless Chris Ledoux
"good ride cowboy"


Posted By: Bigdaddy0381
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 13:26
in my .224 69gr and 70gr work best for the faster twist.


-------------
P&Z Firearms , Pro gun cleanings and gun repair and wood refinishing.

Ecclesiastes 10:2


Posted By: pyro6999
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 13:29
Originally posted by Bigdaddy0381 Bigdaddy0381 wrote:

in my .224 69gr and 70gr work best for the faster twist.

if your using a 1:7 then it should, my .22-250 is old and its got either a 1:12 or 1:14 twist which isnt good for anything that heavy.Bucky


-------------
They call me "Boots"
375H&H Mag: Yeah, it kills stuff "extra dead"

343 we will never forget

God Bless Chris Ledoux
"good ride cowboy"


Posted By: supertool73
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 14:56
My 1-7s don't like anything under 68 very well.  At 50 yards with 62 I only get like 2 inch groups.  With 75s I can get .5 inch at 100 yards.  Its crazy the difference it makes.  

-------------
Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own."


Posted By: BeltFed
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 15:13
Just to be the fly in the ointment. I tried 2 AR barrels from the same manufacturer with the same profile and both are 1 in 8" twist. One barrel likes 62 to 69gr bullits, the other will only shoot 77gr bullits worth a darn.Loco
The 1 in 9" twist barrels i've tried, shot both 55 and 62gr bullits well, but prefered the 62gr bullits. This is expected for the most part, but I was supprised by the 1 in 8" twist results. I also tried a 1 in 7" twist barrel on a Styer Aug, and it did better with 62gr bullits than one of the 1 in 8" twist barrels with 62 or 69gr bullits.Whacko


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Life's concerns should be about the 120lb pack your trying to get to the top of the mountain, and not the rock in your boot.


Posted By: supertool73
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 15:19
I guess that goes to show us, you never really know what will work best til you try a bunch of them.

-------------
Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own."


Posted By: stickbow46
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 17:46
I agree  with the school of thought that the heavier the bullet the faster the twist rate.I do have 2 rifles that do change my logic.700 rem police in .223 ..1:9 twist that shoots best when using .75grn Hornady V max[just defies my logic]but it is dead on out to 300 yds.
 
The other rifle is my Rem 5R in .308 [11.25 twist]which will shoot .168grn & 190grn Sierra BT equally well.Loco
 
 
 


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Pearls of Wisdom are Heard not Spoken


Posted By: koshkin
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 18:48
I have a 1-7" twist in my AR and it has a clear preference for 77gr SMKs over all other bullets I have tried.

ILya


-------------
http://www.darklordofoptics.com - www.darklordofoptics.com
https://rumble.com/c/DLO - Rumble Video Channel


Posted By: tjtjwdad
Date Posted: February/23/2011 at 19:59
- I'm under the impression that all things being equal (weight) the longer the bearing surface, the faster the twist needs to be to stabalize the bullet.
 
- FWIW, it's also known that not all barrel twist are uniform.  In example; a barrel listed as a 1-9 may avtually be a 1- 9.5 or 1- 8.75.  This probably explains why some bullets shoot out of an advertised twist while others won't.
 
- Some bullets just won't shoot in a barrel no matter what you try.  I ran thru this several years ago with an AR-15.  It wouldn't shoot a H75 BTHP (1-8) no matter what.  I was all set to rebarrel when I just happened to try some 77 SMK and presto, it grouped like a premium barrel.
 
- I have a Bushmaster with a 1-9 twist and it won't shoot much over 70 grain bullets with acceptable accuracy for target work.  For grins and giggles I tried a 80 SMK in that barrel and at 100 yards it shot an 8" group.  Went back to a 69 SMK, it was under .250".
 
HTH


Posted By: michiganman
Date Posted: February/24/2011 at 01:33
thanks for all the input everyone. I think i made up my mind im going to go with the 1:8 bull seems like that would be the best performer for all around use. looks like with that twist it will allow me play with wide range of bullet weightBig Grin
 
one of the members asked about making a sticky on barrel twist ,i think that would be a great idea if someone can come up with something .
what i would like to see in the same sticky would be examples of why you would pick that twist for that application.
 
(example)
1:14 -would be good for bullet up to 40g
benefits- max fps
disadvantages- what ever they maybe
application-short rang target, varmit hunting or what ever
 
 


Posted By: steve56
Date Posted: July/06/2011 at 23:20
ya,thosereal  light bullets in a 06 with a 1 in 10 are all over


Posted By: cheaptrick
Date Posted: July/08/2011 at 15:33
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

My 1-7s don't like anything under 68 very well.  At 50 yards with 62 I only get like 2 inch groups.  With 75s I can get .5 inch at 100 yards.  Its crazy the difference it makes.  

What 75gr bullet are you shooting? My 7 twist 5.56 hates anything under 68gr. too. 


Posted By: supertool73
Date Posted: July/08/2011 at 16:04
Hornady HPBT.  Much cheaper than 77 grain SMK.  You can buy them in 600 round lots for about $50 cheaper than 500 SMKs.  Midway has them on sale right now as well.  http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=1165559619 - http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=1165559619


-------------
Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own."


Posted By: Urimaginaryfrnd
Date Posted: July/08/2011 at 21:27
Im running 1 in 7 and 1 in 8 twist shooting 69 to 80 gr   Military uses 1 in 7 with 62 gr

BULLET WEIGHT / CALIBER / TWIST RATE CHART

Grain/Cal.172.204.224.243.257.264.277.284.308.338.358
17-209-10
2510
30912
33 12
35 12
37 VLD6
40 12
50-52 914
55 12
60 12
68-69 9,1013,14
75 9 14
80 8
85 7121212
90 710
100 1010 1214
105-107 8
120 1010 1215,16
130 10 14
140 91010
150 14
140-160 8101012,13
150-168 911,12,13
150-180 10,11,12
160 9
175 9
180 10,11,12
200 10,1110,1212,16
220 10
225 10,1212,16
240-250 101012
300 1012


-------------

"Always do the right thing, just because it is the right thing to do".
Bobby Paul Doherty
Texas Ranger


Posted By: cheaptrick
Date Posted: July/09/2011 at 09:29
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

Hornady HPBT.  Much cheaper than 77 grain SMK.  You can buy them in 600 round lots for about $50 cheaper than 500 SMKs.  Midway has them on sale right now as well.  http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=1165559619 - http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=1165559619

Good deal! Thanks! 


Posted By: koshkin
Date Posted: July/09/2011 at 13:33
Originally posted by cheaptrick cheaptrick wrote:

Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

Hornady HPBT.  Much cheaper than 77 grain SMK.  You can buy them in 600 round lots for about $50 cheaper than 500 SMKs.  Midway has them on sale right now as well.  http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=1165559619 - http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/default.aspx?productNumber=1165559619

Good deal! Thanks! 

I bought a box of those, but have not tried them yet.  My AR likes 77gr SMKs and it seems that the hotter I run them, the better it likes them, so with that bullet I stick to NATO brass and run them at NATO pressures.

It did not like any of the 68, 69 and 75 grain bullets I have tried to date, but for some odd reson it liked the new Hornady 53gr boattail V-Max.  Go figure.

ILya


-------------
http://www.darklordofoptics.com - www.darklordofoptics.com
https://rumble.com/c/DLO - Rumble Video Channel


Posted By: shooter07
Date Posted: July/09/2011 at 15:52
My BCM middy (1-7) loves the hornady 75's. The 1-7 twist rate will generally keep tighter groups with the heavier bullets, from what i've seen. Now with that being said i've had great results with 223 ultra max 55 grainers. I've got plenty of 5.56 Winchester white box (Korean made) because it's cheap and shoots very well out of my rifle. Now get the exact same ammo made in America and it's horrible, which pains me to say.




-------------
Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum

"Issac Newton invented gravity because some asshole hit him with an apple"
-Chris Moltisanti


Posted By: cheaptrick
Date Posted: July/09/2011 at 17:34
Originally posted by shooter07 shooter07 wrote:

My BCM middy (1-7) loves the hornady 75's. The 1-7 twist rate will generally keep tighter groups with the heavier bullets, from what i've seen. Now with that being said i've had great results with 223 ultra max 55 grainers. I've got plenty of 5.56 Winchester white box (Korean made) because it's cheap and shoots very well out of my rifle. Now get the exact same ammo made in America and it's horrible, which pains me to say.



That's what I'm running, Brother. A Bravo Middy. 
Not sure why in the world I haven't tried the heavier bullets in her. I think that the 75gr. ?? TAP ammo sucked so bad at 100 yards, that I gave up. Terrible, terrible groups with that TAP. 


Posted By: shooter07
Date Posted: July/09/2011 at 20:58
Originally posted by cheaptrick cheaptrick wrote:

Originally posted by shooter07 shooter07 wrote:

My BCM middy (1-7) loves the hornady 75's. The 1-7 twist rate will generally keep tighter groups with the heavier bullets, from what i've seen. Now with that being said i've had great results with 223 ultra max 55 grainers. I've got plenty of 5.56 Winchester white box (Korean made) because it's cheap and shoots very well out of my rifle. Now get the exact same ammo made in America and it's horrible, which pains me to say.



That's what I'm running, Brother. A Bravo Middy. 
Not sure why in the world I haven't tried the heavier bullets in her. I think that the 75gr. ?? TAP ammo sucked so bad at 100 yards, that I gave up. Terrible, terrible groups with that TAP. 
 
I wish i had a crapload of cash to go out and buy about 100 different types 223/556 and really pinpoint which over the counter loads do the best. Big Grin I haven't found anything that will go better than 1MOA consistantly at 100. Being that it's a chrome lined barrel, you sacrifice a little accuracy for barrel life, which can be argued both ways. Personally if i'm shooting MOA or close to that with a "battle" rifle that likely never see's battle, i can't complain to much.
 
I'm currently in the market for a 1-8 twist stainless BCM light model. They've been getting rave reviews. For the craftsmanship and price, you simply cannot beat BCM. And they've got tremendous CS as im sure you know.


-------------
Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum

"Issac Newton invented gravity because some asshole hit him with an apple"
-Chris Moltisanti


Posted By: Alan Robertson
Date Posted: July/09/2011 at 23:08
The long- range AR shooters around here go with 1:8 or 1:7.5 and the heaviest bullets they can find.

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"Garg'n uair dhuisgear"


Posted By: cheaptrick
Date Posted: July/10/2011 at 08:10
What powder you using with the 75gr that gives the most accuracy, ST? 

  


Posted By: supertool73
Date Posted: July/10/2011 at 23:19
24.5 grains varget in winchester brass.  CCI small rifle.

-------------
Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own."


Posted By: jjrgr21
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 00:06
hey koshkin, how do those 53's do past 300? i've been using 68's on groundhogs, but they make it back to their holes sometimes.


Posted By: cheaptrick
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 07:16
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

24.5 grains varget in winchester brass.  CCI small rifle.

I was so hoping you'd say Varget! Wink 


Posted By: Dale Clifford
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 08:38
Very few ar barrels are target quality, unless you have one installed by  a smith. Combinations of of nato chambers, Wilde, and 223 chambers and the wide variety of combinations of loads gives interesting results. Sometimes blc2 gives better accuracy, than varget, sometimes Tac. Faster twists sometimes shoot 75 amax, sometimes they prefer more tangent ogives and deeper seating. My experience shows that a barrel that likes 68 gr H. match will shoot 69 gr smk, but rarely 75 gr amax . 77 smk  shoot sometimes, but at that cost you can shoot 308. 60 gr vmax seem to have good all around performance, but rarely stellar. currently I have a rra operator nato chambeer that shoots pmc green tip into 1/2 inch. Figure that one out.

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I love little league baseball-- it keeps the kids out of the house
Yogi Bera



Posted By: Dale Clifford
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 08:47
Getting reliable expansion from 223 is sometimes difficult when using bthp, they are especially dependant on velocity. At longer ranges they tend to pencil through rockchucks, 69 smk being the best in my experience. Usually 50 gr. vmax has worked best for me as the bc of this class is about the same and the extra velocity pays off. Currenty using a Krieger barreled LAR Grizzly target ar with 68 gr H. match, shooting as good as any bolt gun I've had. Hope to test the 24 inch barrel this summer on high country chucks.

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I love little league baseball-- it keeps the kids out of the house
Yogi Bera



Posted By: supertool73
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 09:19
That is the problem with my 16" AR and the 75s, I am only getting like 2550 velocity.  It is very accurate, but very slow.  But it does not shoot the lighter bullets for crap, so I am kind of stuck with it. 

In the future, I think I am going to stick with the 1-9" twist barrels so I can just run the 55s and 60s.   


-------------
Lifetime warranty and excellent customer service don't mean a thing when your gun fails during a zombie attack.

"A Liberal is a person who will give away everything they don't own."


Posted By: BeltFed
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 10:16
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

That is the problem with my 16" AR and the 75s, I am only getting like 2550 velocity.  It is very accurate, but very slow.  But it does not shoot the lighter bullets for crap, so I am kind of stuck with it. 

In the future, I think I am going to stick with the 1-9" twist barrels so I can just run the 55s and 60s.   
Kind of the same conclusion I came to, too.
 
I sat down with some calipers and measured the overall lengths and bearing surfaces of the 77gr SMK and 75gr Horn. bthp. While the SMK was longer and should have better balistic coefficient, the Horn. has a longer bearing surface and should have a little edge on stability and runout in the barrel. The differences don't seem great enough to really make that much of a difference, and maybe there won't be if I can just find that magic load. I know the .30cal. 175 SMK and 178 A-Max have similar performance in one rifle, with a slight edge to the SMK. I'm just hoping to get the same results with the 75 and 77gr pills.


-------------
Life's concerns should be about the 120lb pack your trying to get to the top of the mountain, and not the rock in your boot.


Posted By: jjrgr21
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 10:17
have you tried the 68-69, mine shoots them very well. it shoots the 75's pretty good, and with 24.2 of V and cci 400's, i get about 2700fps.

they both kill the hell out of ground hogs, it guts them, but they make it back to the hole sometimes. so i thought i'd go a bit lighter.


Posted By: shooter07
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 10:56
Originally posted by supertool73 supertool73 wrote:

That is the problem with my 16" AR and the 75s, I am only getting like 2550 velocity.  It is very accurate, but very slow.  But it does not shoot the lighter bullets for crap, so I am kind of stuck with it. 

In the future, I think I am going to stick with the 1-9" twist barrels so I can just run the 55s and 60s.   


Have you checked out the 1-8 twist barrels? I've found some damn good results with a wider range of grain sizes.


-------------
Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum

"Issac Newton invented gravity because some asshole hit him with an apple"
-Chris Moltisanti


Posted By: shooter07
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 10:58
Originally posted by jjrgr21 jjrgr21 wrote:

have you tried the 68-69, mine shoots them very well. it shoots the 75's pretty good, and with 24.2 of V and cci 400's, i get about 2700fps.

they both kill the hell out of ground hogs, it guts them, but they make it back to the hole sometimes. so i thought i'd go a bit lighter.


Hit them in the head and they won't get back to the hole Wink Easier said then done of course.


-------------
Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum

"Issac Newton invented gravity because some asshole hit him with an apple"
-Chris Moltisanti


Posted By: koshkin
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 11:15
Originally posted by jjrgr21 jjrgr21 wrote:

hey koshkin, how do those 53's do past 300? i've been using 68's on groundhogs, but they make it back to their holes sometimes.

So far so good.  I just recently tried that bullet it Hornady's Superformance ammo and it seemed to stay accurate out to 500 yards.  Now, I will try to put some handloads together and see how accurate I can make it.

ILya


-------------
http://www.darklordofoptics.com - www.darklordofoptics.com
https://rumble.com/c/DLO - Rumble Video Channel


Posted By: cheaptrick
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 13:18
Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:

Originally posted by jjrgr21 jjrgr21 wrote:

hey koshkin, how do those 53's do past 300? i've been using 68's on groundhogs, but they make it back to their holes sometimes.

So far so good.  I just recently tried that bullet it Hornady's Superformance ammo and it seemed to stay accurate out to 500 yards.  Now, I will try to put some handloads together and see how accurate I can make it.

ILya

How accurate is accurate, K?


Posted By: jjrgr21
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 13:23
yeah hitting GH's in the head with 16" ar at 300+. most are juvies so they only give you about 1 second up and 8 down. little bastards

i have some 60 vmax that do real good at 200, but start to peter off past 250

thats why i stuck with the 68/75's


Posted By: koshkin
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 13:26
Originally posted by cheaptrick cheaptrick wrote:

Originally posted by koshkin koshkin wrote:

Originally posted by jjrgr21 jjrgr21 wrote:

hey koshkin, how do those 53's do past 300? i've been using 68's on groundhogs, but they make it back to their holes sometimes.

So far so good.  I just recently tried that bullet it Hornady's Superformance ammo and it seemed to stay accurate out to 500 yards.  Now, I will try to put some handloads together and see how accurate I can make it.

ILya

How accurate is accurate, K?

That depends.  This particular AR shoots about 0.75 to 0.9 MOA with handloaded 77gr SMKs.  With factory 53gr Vmax it averaged right around 1 to 1.2 MOA.

I think I can tighten the 77gr SMKs a touch down to consistent 0.75 MOA or better and I think I can bring my 53gr handloads down below 1MOA as well.

How far away I can keep that accuracy is not clear, since the range where I shoot usually has a fair amount of wind.  53gr Vmax and 77gr SMKs seem to have about the same wind drift out to 500 yards or so, which is about all I want out of a 223 under normal circumstances.

My other AR is chambered for 6.5Grendel and is showing much better accuracy potential.  With 123gr SMKs it averages in the 0.5 - 0.7 MOA range. It may be capable of doing better, but I do not think I am capable of shooting that well with any consistency.

ILya


-------------
http://www.darklordofoptics.com - www.darklordofoptics.com
https://rumble.com/c/DLO - Rumble Video Channel


Posted By: jjrgr21
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 15:44
if the 53 and 77 have similar WD out to 500 thats crazy good.

i found that i get better groups with cci400 than with remington BR primers. with the 60 vmax it was a huge difference, around 2" better with the 400's


Posted By: koshkin
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 15:56
Originally posted by jjrgr21 jjrgr21 wrote:

if the 53 and 77 have similar WD out to 500 thats crazy good.

i found that i get better groups with cci400 than with remington BR primers. with the 60 vmax it was a huge difference, around 2" better with the 400's

53gr V-max have pretty sleek profile.  Hornady lists their BC as higher than both 55gr and 60gr Vmaxes.

Since they start out quite a bit faster than 77 grainers, it is not surprising that out to 500 yards they still buck wind petty well.  Beyond that a heavier bullet would do better.

ILya


-------------
http://www.darklordofoptics.com - www.darklordofoptics.com
https://rumble.com/c/DLO - Rumble Video Channel


Posted By: jjrgr21
Date Posted: July/11/2011 at 16:02
i'll pick some up start working on them


Posted By: Sgtshultzy266
Date Posted: July/27/2011 at 16:19
I have a RockRiver predator pursuit 1/8 that shoots everything Ive put thru it well, anywhere from 45gt to 77gr  guess I got a good one.



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