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Lab Radar

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Category: Firearms, Bows, and Ammunition
Forum Name: Reloading & Ballistics
Forum Description: Anything to do with ammunition
URL: http://www.opticstalk.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=43371
Printed Date: March/29/2024 at 09:54
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Topic: Lab Radar
Posted By: nralifer
Subject: Lab Radar
Date Posted: September/22/2016 at 07:12
Anyone out there have experience with the Lab Radar?  Trigger 29 and I had a chance to use one this last weekend. We could track a 30 cal bullet as far as 110 yds. I was a real quick way to measure bullet BCs as well.  

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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR



Replies:
Posted By: RifleDude
Date Posted: September/22/2016 at 10:00
No experience with it, but I'm intrigued by the topic and interested in hearing your findings.

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Ted


Money can't buy happiness... but it's much more comfortable to cry in a Porsche than on a bicycle.


Posted By: Peddler
Date Posted: September/22/2016 at 17:21
Is Hornady's claim of Doppler radar for their new bullets similar to that?

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When you are dead, you don't know you are dead.It is difficult only for others.

It is the same when you are stupid.


Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: September/22/2016 at 20:17
We are going to play with it again this weekend. I can tell you that it is an intriguing instrument. We did have some trouble tracking each shot the same distance. I think this has due to with the bullet trajectory.  We were shooting at a gong 500 yds away and were able to track 2-3 shots out of 5.  When the target was at 100 yds 90+% of the shots tracked. So if the bullet stays in the beam it tracks.  There are also a couple of ways to trigger it. We used the microphone. Using that mode we could trigger it with, not only the muzzle blast, but also with the crack of the bullet as it passed the radar. For that experiment we placed the radar behind the gong to protect it and shot from 150 yds such that the bullet passed within 4-5 inches from the gong edge. It tracked 2 out of three shots to 100 yds. One can calculate BCs on any bullet with the data since it will measure 5 velocities as it tracks the bullet.

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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR


Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: September/22/2016 at 20:24
The Hornady Doppler is much more powerful and sophisticated but both radars work on the same principle. Hornady's radar can track bullets to hundreds of yards and generate a velocity decay curve since it can measure velocities at much smaller intervals.  It was through the analysis of these decay curves that they were able to surmise that their tips were melting presumably

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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR


Posted By: Peddler
Date Posted: September/23/2016 at 04:11
Presumably being the key word i suppose.

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When you are dead, you don't know you are dead.It is difficult only for others.

It is the same when you are stupid.


Posted By: trigger29
Date Posted: September/23/2016 at 04:42
Originally posted by nralifer nralifer wrote:

The Hornady Doppler is much more powerful and sophisticated but both radars work on the same principle. Hornady's radar can track bullets to hundreds of yards and generate a velocity decay curve since it can measure velocities at much smaller intervals.  It was through the analysis of these decay curves that they were able to surmise that their marketing gimmick was going to sell a boat load of bullets.
   Well, I'm glad we're in agreement on that one. ;)

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"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."


Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: September/23/2016 at 05:17
Excellent

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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: September/23/2016 at 06:02

Bryan Litz is "the man" in ballistics...


http://appliedballisticsllc.com/Truth%20In%20Performance/Hornady4DOF.pdf - http://appliedballisticsllc.com/Truth%20In%20Performance/Hornady4DOF.pdf


I pay close attention to his cautions.


http://www.scout.com/military/snipers-hide/forums/5542-ballistics/13788862-labradar-testing - http://www.scout.com/military/snipers-hide/forums/5542-ballistics/13788862-labradar-testing



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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: trigger29
Date Posted: September/23/2016 at 15:39

I will agree that Bryan Litz is "the man" when it comes to ballistics, so long as Berger bullets aren't involved. He knows who signs his pay check. We've found some discrepancies in our testing with several bullet's BCs, from several different manufacturers. These discrepancies seem to correlate with the data listed in Litz's book "Ballistic Performance of Rifle Bullets".  Unless a Berger bullet happens to be involved. Seems their bullets always have the highest listed BC.  And it also seems we can't achieve the numbers he lists. It seems we're not the only ones who have discovered this in actual instrumented tests.  This test done by KNS ballistic services found the .338 Hybrid to have  a BC of .766 vs. the .816 they claim. all the other data they got on other bullets correlates with Litz's data except the Berger bullet.


http://www.scout.com/military/snipers-hide/story/1454719-gunsite-xlr-338-bullet-test - http://www.scout.com/military/snipers-hide/story/1454719-gunsite-xlr-338-bullet-test


As far as his testing of the Labradar, after his last update, it seems he's very happy with the results he's gotten from it, and it's showing itself to be very accurate.   In our limited testing of it so far, we've found the same, and actually used it to do some limited BC calculations on bullets that we know the BC on, and found it to accurately calculate BC within reasonable accuracy levels. We're going to do more testing with 2 radar units to try to verify BCs over a longer range. Will update when we have more results.



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"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."


Posted By: Steelbenz
Date Posted: September/23/2016 at 22:08
As an old FireControlman, I'll give you the standard tracker alley saying! "In God we trust, ALL others we track!" My father's favorite saying was "Liars know numbers son, but numbers don't lie! Do the math!

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"Don't argue with a fool! From a distance you can't really tell who's who!"


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: September/24/2016 at 06:29

You know, I have no hero worship of Bryan Litz, neither do I have a problem with KNS.  Any competitor in business has to try to find a way to make his product stand out.

Bryan Litz does demonstrate very high numbers for Berger products... but, could be his test articles are produced with more care than what can be obtained via normal channels.  There are a number of possible explanations for Litz's numbers vs KNS.  One is that he has access to the very best product Berger produces... may not be exactly representative of "off the assembly line".  Differing conditions, controls, test articles, test personnel,etc.  He also has had access to some of the very finest radars used for ballistic calculations.  I don't know whether his results come from the fact that "he knows where his paycheck comes from" or not.  But I know that his methods, as described, are sound and his "math" is true.  I won't be the one to accuse him of fudging the data...

I started thinking of getting the Lab Radar as soon as it came out... fulfills a number of requirements for me even in its current state.  But I've been waiting until the product matched the available technology.  Oftentimes, what is available to the public is several generations behind what is available technologically.  I believe they are on Gen III now.  More to come.

Certainly Mr Litz wants to sell his products, personal and Berger, so do other companies...

There was never an intention to say the stuff was not good, just some caution in observation should be exercised.  Perhaps the concept was too lofty...

As for the Lab Radar, certainly a device that provides an accuracy and simplicity that has been long needed and unattained... my point in the articles was:

"For the great majority of mankind are satisfied with appearances, as though they were realities, and are often more influenced by the things that seem than the things that are." Machiavelli

Caveat emptor.




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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: September/24/2016 at 06:29
Two very good links by Kickboxer.Excellent  Our initial test did not involve a direct comparison to the Oehler 35, although in all our other BC testing the Oehler was used to measure the muzzle velocity.  We used the radar to determine the muzzle velocity and used our usual 2 radio set up and Audacity waveform software to measure time of flight.  Doing this we were able to calculate 2 BCs for each shot, one from the radar data alone and the other from the time of flight data to a gong target 500 yds away.  The average BC calculated for each shot that we had a full set of data correlated with each other to less than 2%.  The tracking with the radar was a bit problematic when shooting at a 500 yd target, but when shooting at a 100 yd target it tracked much more reliably suggesting that the bullet trajectory seen in the long target shots probably caused the bullet to be at the very edge of the radar beam and not track as well.  We were testing 308 and 338 caliber bullets with boat tails whose bases were flat, so did not have the problem Litz saw with the concave based FMJ .224 cal bullets.  Of note is that the microphone in the radar was used as the trigger for the radar.

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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: September/24/2016 at 06:46

Originally posted by nralifer nralifer wrote:

Two very good links by Kickboxer.Excellent  Our initial test did not involve a direct comparison to the Oehler 35, although in all our other BC testing the Oehler was used to measure the muzzle velocity.  We used the radar to determine the muzzle velocity and used our usual 2 radio set up and Audacity waveform software to measure time of flight.  Doing this we were able to calculate 2 BCs for each shot, one from the radar data alone and the other from the time of flight data to a gong target 500 yds away.  The average BC calculated for each shot that we had a full set of data correlated with each other to less than 2%.  The tracking with the radar was a bit problematic when shooting at a 500 yd target, but when shooting at a 100 yd target it tracked much more reliably suggesting that the bullet trajectory seen in the long target shots probably caused the bullet to be at the very edge of the radar beam and not track as well.  We were testing 308 and 338 caliber bullets with boat tails whose bases were flat, so did not have the problem Litz saw with the concave based FMJ .224 cal bullets.  Of note is that the microphone in the radar was used as the trigger for the radar.

That is pretty impressive. 

We use microphones as triggers as well.  Funny, we found that "better" is not always "best".  We had to actually decrease the quality of microphone in order to get the most accurate triggers.  Best results have come from a $2.00 Walmart microphone. 



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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: September/25/2016 at 08:24
We did more testing with the radar yesterday This time under different conditions and using an SD card. I think an SD card will become a regular part of our testing. We used the radar at the gun club instead of an open field.  There was more "clutter" down range at the club because of wind flags and berms at 100 yds. The 100 yd range is next to a 200 yd rage that has a double berm, the lower one with a target backboard at 185 yds which is where we mounted targets.  The BC results we were getting were all over the place, and when we looked at the data on the SD card we could see why. The radar is capable, with the SD card, to give a velocity at almost every yard of bullet travel, and display the data on an Exel spread sheet.  So if you see your bullet actually at some point accelerating you know the data is funky.  We think the problem was all the clutter down range. Hopefully next week we will be able to get back to more open country with no clutter.  On shots where the tracking data looked clean (consistently lower velocity with each yard of bullet travel) the BC calculated seemed plausible both for sour bullets and factory.

Another observation is that the radar will not trigger using the internal microphone if you shoot with a suppressor. Have to trigger it using the Doppler signal itself. Wonder if Kickboxer might have some thoughts on using an external microphone as a trigger for suppressed rifles. A microphone triggering mechanism may be more accurate than the Doppler as one does not always know at what distance down range the signal from the bullet triggers the radar.  One good thing though the radar was not triggered by other people shooting. Oner people were either shooting pistols or 223 ARs.

So there is a bit of a learning curve, but once one learns how to use it properly the radar should be very handy.


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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: September/25/2016 at 10:20
Originally posted by nralifer nralifer wrote:

We did more testing with the radar yesterday This time under different conditions and using an SD card. I think an SD card will become a regular part of our testing. We used the radar at the gun club instead of an open field.  There was more "clutter" down range at the club because of wind flags and berms at 100 yds. The 100 yd range is next to a 200 yd rage that has a double berm, the lower one with a target backboard at 185 yds which is where we mounted targets.  The BC results we were getting were all over the place, and when we looked at the data on the SD card we could see why. The radar is capable, with the SD card, to give a velocity at almost every yard of bullet travel, and display the data on an Exel spread sheet.  So if you see your bullet actually at some point accelerating you know the data is funky.  We think the problem was all the clutter down range. Hopefully next week we will be able to get back to more open country with no clutter.  On shots where the tracking data looked clean (consistently lower velocity with each yard of bullet travel) the BC calculated seemed plausible both for sour bullets and factory.

Another observation is that the radar will not trigger using the internal microphone if you shoot with a suppressor. Have to trigger it using the Doppler signal itself. Wonder if Kickboxer might have some thoughts on using an external microphone as a trigger for suppressed rifles. A microphone triggering mechanism may be more accurate than the Doppler as one does not always know at what distance down range the signal from the bullet triggers the radar.  One good thing though the radar was not triggered by other people shooting. Oner people were either shooting pistols or 223 ARs.

So there is a bit of a learning curve, but once one learns how to use it properly the radar should be very handy.

We use the external microphone for all our triggers... found it to be much more accurate and repeatable.  You will have to do some experimentation to find the proper angle for maximum trigger effects for you in your environment.  It is easier for us, now, since we mostly use same place/configuration, but still have to perform a calibration every time.

You are experiencing both clutter and multipath to introduce the effects you describe. It never goes completely away... maybe at high altitudes or in space.  Multipath can create some very odd effects.  What you are most likely seeing that appears to be an acceleration at the wrong place in time is a signal late arrival due to multipath.  It can be very frustrating.



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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: September/25/2016 at 15:00

I read through the manual.  Setup of a radar device can be critical.  I would have to do some experimentation with the system to determine root cause of your "issue", but the below information indicates you could certainly be getting some "stray" signals injected into your data stream:



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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: September/27/2016 at 20:50
Thanks Kickboxer for such a thoughtful response. Really is helpful.  I think the problem was a flag close to the bullet trajectory. The multipath phenomenon is an interesting. Does a metal gong placed beyond 100 yd potentially interfere with the signal quality?

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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 06:19
Anything in the field of view of the radar could create a false reading.  I don't know anything about rejection algorithms of the Lab Radar, but suspect, if they exist, they are not highly complex... cost would be prohibitive. 

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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: Bigdaddy0381
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 06:31
I used a lab radar at one of my matches. It was spot on with what my other velocity meters have told me. I kinda liked it, and thought about getting one.


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P&Z Firearms , Pro gun cleanings and gun repair and wood refinishing.

Ecclesiastes 10:2


Posted By: Steelbenz
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 07:34
Something else to think about is side lobes, probably not a big deal but things close to the unit head may also cause issues. Just a thought!

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"Don't argue with a fool! From a distance you can't really tell who's who!"


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 07:38

Clutter/multipath can be managed... much easier than other impediments to "standard" chronographs.  Based upon what I have seen and heard of the Lab Radar, it is the hottest thing around for load development.  Upgrades should mostly be software driven, the hardware technology is well understood, so risk is low.  Its limitations, for the intended use, are all relatively easily managed. 

I intend to get one when I am finally FORCED to start loading again. 



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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: Steelbenz
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 08:54
I have looked at the system, but I just couldn't justify the cost. I went with the Magnetospeed sporter and for my purposes it works well.

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"Don't argue with a fool! From a distance you can't really tell who's who!"


Posted By: Bigdaddy0381
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 09:38
ewwww, You know you have to redo your loads when you start shooting the cans ( well your suppose too).... guess what, the Magnetospeed wont work with cans...


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P&Z Firearms , Pro gun cleanings and gun repair and wood refinishing.

Ecclesiastes 10:2


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 10:13

Originally posted by Bigdaddy0381 Bigdaddy0381 wrote:

ewwww, You know you have to redo your loads when you start shooting the cans ( well your suppose too).... guess what, the Magnetospeed wont work with cans...







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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: SVT_Tactical
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 10:43

Originally posted by Bigdaddy0381 Bigdaddy0381 wrote:

ewwww, You know you have to redo your loads when you start shooting the cans ( well your suppose too).... guess what, the Magnetospeed wont work with cans...

Why not?  Says they do on their site.



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"Most folks are about as happy as they make their minds up to be" - Abraham Lincoln


Posted By: Bigdaddy0381
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 11:14

Dude I'm just going by my findings.

I used the V something or another I want to say 3 this weekend and they were way off. The lab radar was dead on with the known FPS.


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P&Z Firearms , Pro gun cleanings and gun repair and wood refinishing.

Ecclesiastes 10:2


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 11:20

The V3 is the one that claims to support suppressor use... the Sporter (less expensive) does not.  Set up is critical on the Magnetospeed.




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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: SVT_Tactical
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 11:28

gotcha.




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"Most folks are about as happy as they make their minds up to be" - Abraham Lincoln


Posted By: Bigdaddy0381
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 12:12
 Heck everyone buy them, suppressor or not  There the best thing on the market..



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P&Z Firearms , Pro gun cleanings and gun repair and wood refinishing.

Ecclesiastes 10:2


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 12:23

There are a number of problems with the magnetospeed... I researched them a while back.  Even if they do work with a suppressor (didn't work for Brandon and I've seen other reports of them not working or not working reliably), mounting to the barrel will change your POI. 

Get the radar...



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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: Steelbenz
Date Posted: September/28/2016 at 14:32
Originally posted by Kickboxer Kickboxer wrote:

The V3 is the one that claims to support suppressor use... the Sporter (less expensive) does not.  Set up is critical on the Magnetospeed.


Set up is indeed critical, sensitive setting is very important. Once I figured out the settings it was dead nuts to my buddy's crono and its just easier! I can't shoot groups with it that's true but I'm just using it for MV for my shooter app. If I was doing ballistics research or design I could justify the Radar's price tag. Plus I think I may have got enough RF radiation as a TAS tech. 2 years after leaving the service I got to see a notification of a dangerous side lobe off the TWT. Yup, you guest it, my desk in the TAS shack was dead center of the side lobe! I always wondered I am the only crome dome in the family! LOL!

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"Don't argue with a fool! From a distance you can't really tell who's who!"


Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: October/01/2016 at 07:52
The problem I had with the Magnetospeed is the bayonet loosened after virtually every shot. It was useful when the lighting conditions were such that Oehler would not work reliably though. The radar gives one much more data, and if used with an SD card you can make judgments as to the quality of the data.  Once one figures out what sort of things create artifacts in the data, it is very useful in comparing bullet BCs and for bullet development.  It can work off of a rechargeable battery pack as well using the USB cable provided with it.

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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR


Posted By: 338LAPUASLAP
Date Posted: October/02/2016 at 19:37

Apologies to all I have been absent due to work and the such.

WHEN did these hit the market?

Any issues with them?

Is there anything else on the market like these for the price?

Do not mean to hi-jack.

I did not read the review on the other place.

Sum it up for me fellas.

I get about 10min a day for personal things such as this cannot even be caught reading anything but my children's' schoolwork or my work or the bills.




Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: October/29/2016 at 05:25
We have had more experiences with the radar and would like to share them. We have been using two of them, one 300 yds downrange behind a gong, to get downrange velocities, as well as muzzle velocities. The downrange radar is triggered by the supersonic crack of the bullet and needs to pass by it by a few inches. Also we used a target cam to see the downrange radar display. The down range radar tracked the bullets another 75-110 yds.  This setup gave us excellent data, and allowed us to compare our bullets with those of other manufacturers. The beauty of this set up is that you can get a BC within the first 100 yds and a down range BC.  One thing that would be great would be the availability of a graphics program that could take the SD card data and plot the velocity data as a function of distance from the radar and generate a velocity decay curve for each shot.  The SD card data can be displayed on Exel  either in Apple or Windows systems.

To 338's question, I do not know of any similar systems on the market.  The only issues with the radar is that you have to have an uncluttered downrange to get clean data, and I wish there was more info on the beam height and width, and a better aiming system for the radar. These things could improve the capture rate and track the bullets further.  We were able to track bullets as small as 17 caliber, however.


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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR


Posted By: Steelbenz
Date Posted: October/30/2016 at 21:34
For what you are using it for I understand perfectly the need for the systems. I wonder if minitab 17 would work for what you want to do? As for the average jack leg reloader like myself it might be seen as overkill and I'm OCD as hell!

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"Don't argue with a fool! From a distance you can't really tell who's who!"


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: October/31/2016 at 05:07

Steel, you keep sounding like you are trying, desperately, to talk yourself out of the radar.  Dude, you KNOW you need it... it will take you to that "next level".  Radar is "where it's at" in exterior ballistics. 

Go for it... let the "rush" take you... be the best you can be...

Lab Radar... get one...



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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: Steelbenz
Date Posted: October/31/2016 at 09:24
Dan, when we retire lets go into piracy prevention, used car sales are to flooded with people already! 😉

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"Don't argue with a fool! From a distance you can't really tell who's who!"


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: October/31/2016 at 12:20

There is nothing to see here... get the radar...

You are one with the radar...


get the radar...



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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: Steelbenz
Date Posted: November/01/2016 at 05:04
Well, there goes my Christmas bonus! 😂😂😂

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"Don't argue with a fool! From a distance you can't really tell who's who!"


Posted By: trigger29
Date Posted: November/01/2016 at 09:23
In all honesty...... you probably wouldn't regret it.

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"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."


Posted By: Steelbenz
Date Posted: November/01/2016 at 09:56
I will give one negative on the magnetospeed and how I know you don't want to shoot groups with it is I was working up a H4350 load for my 6.5CM and shot groups while having the bayonet attached. Got a 5 shot group that was .3 MOA, had ES of 26 and a SD of 9. Felt like that was "The Load" and loaded up some more. Shot it at 500 yards, now without the magnetospeed and had 2 MOA vertical stringing group. Checked the load again with the chrono and yup same 2708fps with an SD of 8. The bayonet changed the barrel harmonics that much.

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"Don't argue with a fool! From a distance you can't really tell who's who!"


Posted By: Alan Robertson
Date Posted: November/01/2016 at 10:44
Hunt with your magnetospeed attached.


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"Garg'n uair dhuisgear"


Posted By: Steelbenz
Date Posted: November/01/2016 at 11:07
I never hunt with that rifle. Just my ARs.

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"Don't argue with a fool! From a distance you can't really tell who's who!"


Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: November/03/2016 at 06:01
Alan, for some reason your comment cracked me up Excellent

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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: November/03/2016 at 08:23

I'm going to do it...

Seemed like a good idea...



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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: Bigdaddy0381
Date Posted: November/03/2016 at 08:28
so your getting a radar huh.... It will help A LOT when you start loading for all those AR's you have.



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P&Z Firearms , Pro gun cleanings and gun repair and wood refinishing.

Ecclesiastes 10:2


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: November/03/2016 at 08:35

Originally posted by Bigdaddy0381 Bigdaddy0381 wrote:

so your getting a radar huh.... It will help A LOT when you start loading for all those AR's you have.

hunting with the magnetospeed...



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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: November/03/2016 at 08:36
But, I like radar...

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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: November/12/2016 at 06:19
Jason and I tried the radar with his suppressed .338 Lapua. Just got all kinds of funky numbers in terms of BC measured.  Looks like a good loud BANG is the best way to trigger the radar to get muzzle velocities. Will need to repeat with the muzzle brake and use ear muffs and ear plugs and warn the county that the noise they hear is not artillery.Nuke

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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR


Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: November/12/2016 at 06:45
One thing about the radar, it eats up a lot of batteries.  We got a rechargeable  Pocket Juice battery pack from Walmart for about $25 and were able to run the radar for 4 hrs straight and only used 25% of the power on that pack. 

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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR


Posted By: Kickboxer
Date Posted: November/12/2016 at 09:39
Originally posted by nralifer nralifer wrote:

Jason and I tried the radar with his suppressed .338 Lapua. Just got all kinds of funky numbers in terms of BC measured.  Looks like a good loud BANG is the best way to trigger the radar to get muzzle velocities. Will need to repeat with the muzzle brake and use ear muffs and ear plugs and warn the county that the noise they hear is not artillery.Nuke

As I stated earlier in this, using a microphone for a trigger initiation is an art… we spend hours adjusting ours (a little play on words there) at every test.  Angles required for max efficiency change due to atmospheric conditions, minor changes in systems locations, etc.  It should be possible to adjust the mic so that your trigger functions properly even with a suppressor (more difficult using subsonic ammo)… OR, you can just go to unsuppressed and save some time and effort, but you lose all the fun of experimentation… and that doesn't give you data about what is happening when suppressed.  You are getting reflected and diminished sound on exit which could create multiple triggers, and if subsonic you are not getting the sound barrier "pop".  Definitely more of a challenge.  Not sure what testing suppressed will buy you, other than the sheer joy of testing things…  


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Opinion,untempered by fact,is ignorance.

There are some who do not fear death... for they are more afraid of not really living


Posted By: nralifer
Date Posted: November/14/2016 at 20:03
Thanks for your comment, KickboxerExcellent  Very illuminating (no pun intended). Looks like we will need to use Jason's Lapua with the muzzle brake and hope it does not blow the radar off the table.

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It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed. TR



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