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Son of Ed View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son of Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/20/2014 at 09:20
Yes....I have read about the quality of those oldies.  However, I can't help but think that I can get a new Zen Ray ZRS for the price of those 50 year old Rangemasters and Zephyrs.  

If I am approaching the $100 mark ( or higher ) in my 'shopping' , I am now in the attitude that I had better be searching for a Real Bargain of the Century, something like a Zeiss or an old Hensoldt or a Swift Audubon...because I am now in New Binocular Territory at those prices.  

If you can get Leupold Yosemites for $85-100 range, you have to weigh that against what you are bidding on.

...once you get up into the mid-hundreds and $200 range, you are in new Zen-Ray country.  

I like to find stuff that can be had for under $35!!  

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son of Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/20/2014 at 09:26
When it comes to binoculars, I am down here in YARD SALE level!!  Roll on Floor Laughing I just try to get some that are decent and work correctly.  I am happy seeing things magnified and not get a headache.  I would love to have big State-of-the-Art Optics, but I wouldn't be able to give a review of them...I would just be able to look through them and say: BOY! THAT LOOKS REAL GOOD!   




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pierre D. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/25/2014 at 12:20
I am in the same boat with Ed. I look at the bargains I can find on ebay and other such sites.

I do own some new binos, but I love the look/quality feel of the vintage "black pebble grain" era porro prism binos I grew up with.
The best of the vintage ones I own leave me feeling I'm not giving up a whole lot vs. the new binos out there.

I just recently bought a 1961 Swift 8.5 x 44 Audubon on ebay - probably the best of all my vintage binos, it rivals the newest Nikons I own with modern lens coatings: Nikon Egret 8x40s porro.
The Swifts have a good image even in the dark, great depth of field and a 420 FT @ 1000yd FOV. What I really like about them is how easy they on my eyes during prolonged use and have a crisp, clear image except for just a little softness at the edge.
Pretty impressive specs too for a bino from 1961:
-BaK4 prisms
-Neoprene gasket selaed to keep dirt out (but not waterproof)
probably why they had perfectly clear optics when I received them
-twist up/down aluminum eyecups
-fully coated glass (this was before multi-coating was developed)


Good luck on your ongoing search for bargains. The good news is if you keep looking diligently you'll come across some great finds on occasion!

All the best,
Pierre
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Klamath Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/25/2014 at 15:07
I like a bargain as well as the next guy.  With the exception of my two 7x35 Bushnell Rangemasters, a Bushnell Custom 7x35, and a Baush & Lomb Zephyr 8x30 I have not paid much over $40 for any of my vintage porros.

As far as Ed's getting getting into new binocular price territory, get a Zephyr 8x 30 side by side with ANY of today's $2-300 porros and get back to me on how much the new is better than the Zephyr...they just are not better.
Steve
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son of Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/25/2014 at 18:31
I have seen Zephyrs on ebay for about $299 in mint condition.  Are the Zephyrs better than the Zeiss Jenoptem?  I have seen them go for less than $200 in great shape.  

I thought the new stuff was going to be better than the 50-60 year old stuff.  But, I can't compare, I don't have a Zephyr or any new 8X30.  And, aren't the Yosemites waterproof?     




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Klamath Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/25/2014 at 22:16
Originally posted by Son of Ed Son of Ed wrote:

I have seen Zephyrs on ebay for about $299 in mint condition.  Are the Zephyrs better than the Zeiss Jenoptem?  I have seen them go for less than $200 in great shape.  

I thought the new stuff was going to be better than the 50-60 year old stuff.  But, I can't compare, I don't have a Zephyr or any new 8X30.  And, aren't the Yosemites waterproof?     





That is on the high side for a Zephyr.  It better be NIB  clean for that much.  I paid $249 for mine.  They had little exterior wear, a 90% case, the original box and the original B&L owners manual, just like what you would have gotten when new.  This is where it gets tricky buying used vintage stuff.  They were advertised as missing a screw on eye cup, no big deal I had a couple that would fit, and in general good working order and clean inside.  They were frozen solid, the hinge would not flex, the focus would not move.  I could not get the glass apart myself to clean it.  I let the seller have it in an email and he eventually refunded a bunch of the price.  I sent them off to Nicholas Crista for refurbishing (best money I ever spent on a binocular service job).  I am into them for $250 and you can't better them but precious little with a Nikon SE.  I still am trying to get around the idea these were made in 1951.  The Zephyr cost about $150 in post WW II economy which was like $1,500 in today's $$.  Totally made in the USA binocular, maybe even the last such when B&L went to Japan in the 70's.  The last were made in 1986.

The 8x30 and 9x35 Zephyrs are the rare ones.  Back in the day B&L pushed the 7x35 as the best all around size, so there are quite a few of those.  Good 7x35's can be found for $75 or so.  They also came in 6x30 and 7x50.

I would say the Zephyr kicks the butt of both of my Jenoptems, including my multi coated Jenoptem from the last  production year of 1986.

Yes the Yosemite is waterproof Smile.  But it does not focus nearly as smoothly as the Zephyr and...well they are different animals.  I have recommended a Yosemite many times in the past and will continue to do so, they are remarkable for their price point.

Best deal I ever got was a Swift Audubon 8.5x44 from 1968 for $20.  They are perfect optically and needed no cleaning or repair at all.

In point of fact, most of the newer stuff will be better than the older vintage models.  I think we get so tied up in reading about all the new fangled bells and whistles of today's wonder glass it does a lot of good to get hold of a golden oldie (alpha for their time) porro and let it speak for itself.


Edited by Klamath - April/25/2014 at 22:29
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son of Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/27/2014 at 11:09


Waiting for Klamath to come back.....


















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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son of Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: April/27/2014 at 11:13

" By the time he comes back on, Eduardo will have forgotten what he was going to ask him..."   






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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pierre D. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2014 at 14:27
Steve - appreciate the input on Bausch & Lomb Zephyrs.

I have been wanting to find one for years now since borrowing an 7x35 Zephyr from a neighbor on a hunting trip when I was a Senior in high school (1977 - OK, I'm dating myself!) I was very, very impressed.

I have been searching ebay, other auction sites and visiting pawn shops / flea markets, optics stores that carry vinbtage binos, etc. on and off for the past ten+ years.   
For the most part the Zephyrs I have come across were either nice but overpriced, or beat up and overpriced for their condition. I have lost out on several ebay auctions for Zephyrs that went too high - typically in the last hours of a bidding "feeding frenzy".
I have noticed that almost all I have seen have been 7x35s, which tracks with your coomments about these being the most common. I have come across only four or so 8x30s and 7x50s during this time out of the dozens and dozens I have seen, and no 9x35s or 6x30s that I can recall.

Perseverance does pay off - if you persevere long enough! I just bought an 8x30 Zephyr on ebay today; $137.24 total including shipping. Has the original black leather case/strap & bino strap. Binos in very good optical condition, all leather also in very good condition according to the photos and my correspondence with the vendor.

Will post an update when I receive them, quite happy to finally have added one to my collection!


QUESTION to all on this forum:
Does anyone know if there is a way to date these?
For Swift binos, the last 2 digits of the year of manufacture is part of the serial # - don't know if it's that easy for Zephyrs.

Appreciate any feedback.


Originally posted by Klamath Klamath wrote:

Originally posted by Son of Ed Son of Ed wrote:

I have seen Zephyrs on ebay for about $299 in mint condition.  Are the Zephyrs better than the Zeiss Jenoptem?  I have seen them go for less than $200 in great shape.  

I thought the new stuff was going to be better than the 50-60 year old stuff.  But, I can't compare, I don't have a Zephyr or any new 8X30.  And, aren't the Yosemites waterproof?     






That is on the high side for a Zephyr.  It better be NIB  clean for that much.  I paid $249 for mine.  They had little exterior wear, a 90% case, the original box and the original B&L owners manual, just like what you would have gotten when new.  This is where it gets tricky buying used vintage stuff.  They were advertised as missing a screw on eye cup, no big deal I had a couple that would fit, and in general good working order and clean inside.  They were frozen solid, the hinge would not flex, the focus would not move.  I could not get the glass apart myself to clean it.  I let the seller have it in an email and he eventually refunded a bunch of the price.  I sent them off to Nicholas Crista for refurbishing (best money I ever spent on a binocular service job).  I am into them for $250 and you can't better them but precious little with a Nikon SE.  I still am trying to get around the idea these were made in 1951.  The Zephyr cost about $150 in post WW II economy which was like $1,500 in today's $$.  Totally made in the USA binocular, maybe even the last such when B&L went to Japan in the 70's.  The last were made in 1986.

The 8x30 and 9x35 Zephyrs are the rare ones.  Back in the day B&L pushed the 7x35 as the best all around size, so there are quite a few of those.  Good 7x35's can be found for $75 or so.  They also came in 6x30 and 7x50.

I would say the Zephyr kicks the butt of both of my Jenoptems, including my multi coated Jenoptem from the last  production year of 1986.

Yes the Yosemite is waterproof Smile.  But it does not focus nearly as smoothly as the Zephyr and...well they are different animals.  I have recommended a Yosemite many times in the past and will continue to do so, they are remarkable for their price point.

Best deal I ever got was a Swift Audubon 8.5x44 from 1968 for $20.  They are perfect optically and needed no cleaning or repair at all.

In point of fact, most of the newer stuff will be better than the older vintage models.  I think we get so tied up in reading about all the new fangled bells and whistles of today's wonder glass it does a lot of good to get hold of a golden oldie (alpha for their time) porro and let it speak for itself.



All the best,
Pierre
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Klamath Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2014 at 17:47
Yes, Zephyrs can be dated.  There is lettering to indicate this.  Don't have it right handy, but post the serial number complete with letters and it can be done easily.

Edit:  This photo comes from Simon Spiers collection.  Simon posts here time to time.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/binoculars/7557689202/
Steve
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son of Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2014 at 19:13
How are the Hensoldt Fero 16 8X30s?  We see them on ebay all the time.  I understand that they are, like, impossible to get into for cleaning...I was wondering if they are a good binocular even if they are 20-30 years old and used.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Klamath Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/02/2014 at 22:28
Originally posted by Son of Ed Son of Ed wrote:

How are the Hensoldt Fero 16 8X30s?  We see them on ebay all the time.  I understand that they are, like, impossible to get into for cleaning...I was wondering if they are a good binocular even if they are 20-30 years old and used.

Sometimes there are some examples of poorly repaired binoculars where the binocular was literally glued back together.  This is particularly true of the immediate post WW II era.  Things were a mess and anything that might be sold was dug from rubble and "fixed".  This has obviously led to some "tales".  Some true and some not.  There is nothing inherent in the design of any of those German 8x30 that preclude them being taken apart for servicing.

The Hensoldt should be a pretty decent binocular.  Holger Merlitz points out the early 1950's makrolon plastic body was prone to irreversible damage.

http://www.holgermerlitz.de/edf7x40.html
Steve
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coyote95 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/13/2014 at 19:07
Here is a pair of 10x50's that I've had sense the early 70's I'm pretty sure they came from Sears & Roebuck.The fov seems to be pretty narrow compared to the newer stuff. The glass is surprising good!




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Klamath Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/14/2014 at 19:12
They may have come from Sears, but Hulda is not the Sears brand binocular name, that is Discovery.  You are right in that they have a narrow fov.  The angular 5* fov is only an apparent fov of 50*.  Typically an afov of 60* is considered wide field.  Those old porros do have some pretty impressive images.

The JB-149 indicates the binocular was built by   Urawa Kogaku Seiki Seisakujo Co. Ltd.

The JE 28 indicates the body was supplied by  Fuji Seinñtsukiki Seisakujo Inc

Talk about a couple of mouthfuls!  This is the first time I have seen either of those two names show up on a binocular...which means very little Big Smile




Edited by Klamath - May/14/2014 at 19:22
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote coyote95 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/16/2014 at 10:02
Thanks for the information on these Steve.    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son of Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/22/2014 at 18:49
I couldn't resist any longer.  I ordered a Russian Baigish 8X30 binocular from some outfit in China.  Manufactured by KOMZ in Kazan, Russia.  I will let you know how they are when they arrive.    





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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Klamath Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/23/2014 at 14:30
Chinese duplicity Ed, they say Made in Russia, but they are not Smile.  However they are probably pretty decent.  I'm interested in seeing what you have to say about how well they perform.
Steve
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitterroot Bulls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/23/2014 at 18:21
I have some Russian 8X30s.  They are sharp enough but they are kind of dim and have a strong color bias.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Son of Ed Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/23/2014 at 18:35
$39 plus $2 postage   Bucky
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Bitterroot Bulls Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: May/23/2014 at 19:41
I think mine were around there, but it took a long time to get them shipped from Europe.
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